Eastsidepilot
Western Thunderer
....you can get tablets for that
Prototype Tim Mills' Photos
- Thread starter oldravendale
- Start date
oldravendale
Western Thunderer
It might be a quint art set, Col. I've nothing definitive, though. I'd not picked up the LMS stock, Dave. An interesting observation.
Tim went to Scotland two or three times. He told me that the weather on this particular trip was appalling which may explain the sometimes less than perfect photos. These three subjects look OK to me, though, even if not in the "top drawer".
This is A2 60530 Sayajirao at Perth Station on 12th September 1961. This is a loco I saw for myself in Darlington Works when on its final overhaul in 1964. In 1961 it was shedded at Haymarket and moved around Scotland ending its days at Dundee Tay Bridge where it was withdrawn in November 1966. (SLS). It was scrapped at the end of March 1967 at Motherwell Machinery and Scrap at Wishaw. (Rail UK).
Here's the same loco, same date but at Perth Shed. The Princess Coronation I read as 46226, Duchess of Norfolk. It was a Carlisle Upperby engine at the time although later in the year went to Carlisle Kingmoor from where it was withdrawn in September 1964. (SLS). From there it went to Arnott Young at Troon where it was scrapped during February 1965. (BR Database).
Still at Perth Shed on 12th September 1961 with Caledonian Railway 439 Class 0-4-4T 55204. Its home shed was Oban at this time but it was withdrawn from Perth South at the end of 1962. (SLS). It was stored for almost two years but was scrapped at Motherwell Machinery and Scrap at Wishaw by the end of 1964. (Rail UK). Note short lived North British Class 21 D6148 or 6149 behind.
Two photos of Caledonian Class 72 4-4-0 54486 at Perth Shed on 12th September 1961. It was a Perth South engine at the time from where it was withdrawn in March 1962. (SLS). It was scrapped during November 1963 at Arnott Young in Troon. (BR Database).
Brian
Tim went to Scotland two or three times. He told me that the weather on this particular trip was appalling which may explain the sometimes less than perfect photos. These three subjects look OK to me, though, even if not in the "top drawer".
This is A2 60530 Sayajirao at Perth Station on 12th September 1961. This is a loco I saw for myself in Darlington Works when on its final overhaul in 1964. In 1961 it was shedded at Haymarket and moved around Scotland ending its days at Dundee Tay Bridge where it was withdrawn in November 1966. (SLS). It was scrapped at the end of March 1967 at Motherwell Machinery and Scrap at Wishaw. (Rail UK).
Here's the same loco, same date but at Perth Shed. The Princess Coronation I read as 46226, Duchess of Norfolk. It was a Carlisle Upperby engine at the time although later in the year went to Carlisle Kingmoor from where it was withdrawn in September 1964. (SLS). From there it went to Arnott Young at Troon where it was scrapped during February 1965. (BR Database).
Still at Perth Shed on 12th September 1961 with Caledonian Railway 439 Class 0-4-4T 55204. Its home shed was Oban at this time but it was withdrawn from Perth South at the end of 1962. (SLS). It was stored for almost two years but was scrapped at Motherwell Machinery and Scrap at Wishaw by the end of 1964. (Rail UK). Note short lived North British Class 21 D6148 or 6149 behind.
Two photos of Caledonian Class 72 4-4-0 54486 at Perth Shed on 12th September 1961. It was a Perth South engine at the time from where it was withdrawn in March 1962. (SLS). It was scrapped during November 1963 at Arnott Young in Troon. (BR Database).
Brian
adrian
Flying Squad
My apologies I'm never any use on providing any additional details on the photos. However just to say thanks for posting them - I really love the gritty atmosphere on this first photo.
oldravendale
Western Thunderer
Thanks, Adrian. I'm enjoying processing these and putting them on limited show so if others enjoy them too that's great.
As with many (most?) of the LNER pacifics it was, indeed, named after the racehorse, Simon. You'll have difficulty getting that down a rabbit hole.
Brian
As with many (most?) of the LNER pacifics it was, indeed, named after the racehorse, Simon. You'll have difficulty getting that down a rabbit hole.
Brian
Osgood
Western Thunderer
Express engines don't do much for me (modest tanks / heavy freight more my thing), but the first two pictures of 60530 are delightful - the slightly grainy presentation adds plenty of atmosphere.
Out of interest, what if any post-processing trickery did you have to do to make these images presentable?
Out of interest, what if any post-processing trickery did you have to do to make these images presentable?
oldravendale
Western Thunderer
I agree, Tony. Well done Tim! (And he shot plenty of pics of the smaller tanks and heavy freight too).
The post processing on these was relatively minor and involved nothing in the way of trickery. The one in the station required a little bit of lifting to make it lighter and the dust spots were removed. The one in the shed needed more lifting, dirt removal, a hair over the front of the Coronation painted out and a horizontal black camera scratch removed. The grittiness is the film grain enhanced by the under exposure. I always keep an "original" scan in TIFF format to which I can go back if my "improvements" are compromised - in these two cases I could reduce the grain but the image benefits with it left as photographed.
IMHO this collection is exceptional. It continues to give me the greatest pleasure and I'm pleased that others enjoy these photos as well.
I hope I'll have time to put up some more tomorrow.
Brian
The post processing on these was relatively minor and involved nothing in the way of trickery. The one in the station required a little bit of lifting to make it lighter and the dust spots were removed. The one in the shed needed more lifting, dirt removal, a hair over the front of the Coronation painted out and a horizontal black camera scratch removed. The grittiness is the film grain enhanced by the under exposure. I always keep an "original" scan in TIFF format to which I can go back if my "improvements" are compromised - in these two cases I could reduce the grain but the image benefits with it left as photographed.
IMHO this collection is exceptional. It continues to give me the greatest pleasure and I'm pleased that others enjoy these photos as well.
I hope I'll have time to put up some more tomorrow.
Brian
mickoo
Western Thunderer
60530 was one of two A2's (535 being the other) sent to Polmadie in 1963 as replacements for ailing and rapidly withdrawing Princess Coronations, Polmadie engine men were not impressed and they did make the occasional foray south, certainly to Carlisle and I've seen (infuriatingly cannot find the picture now) a photo of one of the pair leaving Crewe heading north, probably about the rarest picture you can think of.
Hazy as my memory is I'm sure the engine had a yellow stripe in which case it can only be 535 which stayed to the end at Polmadie.
Hazy as my memory is I'm sure the engine had a yellow stripe in which case it can only be 535 which stayed to the end at Polmadie.
mickoo
Western Thunderer
Virtually all of the Peppercorn A2's were racehorses, same for Gresley A3 and Thompson A2/3; the A4's are all birds or commonwealth names. The Peppercorn A1's were a mixture or racehorses, people of note, birds and regions and the Thompson A1/1, A2/2 were linked to Scottish places and history.
The racehorse names were a Doncaster trait going back to the earliest days and carried on/ended with some of the Deltics, the remainder being regiments.
I believe the criteria for the named race horse engines are winners at the Doncaster St Leger course over the years.
Tim Humphreys ex Mudhen
Western Thunderer
Dante was a Derby winner Mick so without checking I would guess the locos were named after winners of the various classic races.
Tim
Tim
John K
Western Thunderer
As a former racing nerd I can say that most were Classic winners but not all.
Knight of the Thistle won the Royal Hunt Cup, Brown Jack one the Champion Hurdle, Dick Turpin won the Chester Cup, St Simon won the Ascot Gold Cup and Victor Wild won the Kempton Park Jubilee handicap.
John K
Knight of the Thistle won the Royal Hunt Cup, Brown Jack one the Champion Hurdle, Dick Turpin won the Chester Cup, St Simon won the Ascot Gold Cup and Victor Wild won the Kempton Park Jubilee handicap.
John K
Arun Sharma
Western Thunderer
I think 60527 was also at Polmadie and also had a yellow cab stripe. 60535 was unusual in that it was never fitted with AWS. Two of the A2/3s [12 and 22] also had yellow cab stripes at Polmadie.
mickoo
Western Thunderer
I missed that one, it was late last night
My memory is that four engines went to Polmadie but I cannot find proof of that and only found two last night, 527 is the third.
Tim Humphreys ex Mudhen
Western Thunderer
Referring to 'Shed by Shed' by Tony Walmsley; in September 1963 512, 522, 524, 527, 530 and 535 were allocated to Polmadie. 530 left in 1964, the rest through 1965.
Tim
Tim
Arun Sharma
Western Thunderer
Att is a pic of 60535 and 60512- both with yellow cab stripes at Polmadie. I have no idea of the provenance of this photo. I didn't take it and it probably comes from digging around a heap of prints at a show some ten years ago when I was building the 7mm DJH kits of these two locos.
I've seen probably contemporaneous pictures of these three pacifics at Polmadie. The unidentified A2 is 60527 I think - and it would also have had a yellow cab stripe. Note that unlike 60535, it also has AWS trunking along the running plate.
I've also seen Mickoo's picture regarding an A2 at Crewe. It was published in a magazine some years ago. Steam World springs to mind but I'm not sure.
I've seen probably contemporaneous pictures of these three pacifics at Polmadie. The unidentified A2 is 60527 I think - and it would also have had a yellow cab stripe. Note that unlike 60535, it also has AWS trunking along the running plate.
I've also seen Mickoo's picture regarding an A2 at Crewe. It was published in a magazine some years ago. Steam World springs to mind but I'm not sure.
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Arun Sharma
Western Thunderer
I found another photograph of the same scene from a different angle. Annotation on the back confirms that it was taken at Polmadie on 18 April 1965. It also says '50p Nevis' so another one from an exhibition somewhere.
The different litter suggests that the two pics were not taken on the same day. I suspect that the tender rear seen behind Hornet's Beauty belongs to another ex-LNER pacific.
The different litter suggests that the two pics were not taken on the same day. I suspect that the tender rear seen behind Hornet's Beauty belongs to another ex-LNER pacific.
daifly
Western Thunderer
The annotation may refer to the seller. I have a considerable number of books that I bought from Nevill Bridger when he had his shop in Marlborough, Wilts. and all are marked 'Nevis'.
Nev used to sell photos too but, as large numbers were stolen, he sadly stopped selling from that branch.
I'm not pointing a finger, Arun!!
Dave
Arun Sharma
Western Thunderer
Dave - I may well have bought that picture from the art gallery Nevill hired space from in Marlborough. It was always a nice day out browsing in the back rooms of the gallery.
oldravendale
Western Thunderer
Thank you all for your additional and extended info about the Scottish A2s. All carefully preserved. I so much appreciate the personal reminiscences. too. IMHO they add so much life to the thread.
First is V2 60851 at Stirling Station leaving on the St Mungo to Glasgow on 12th September 1961. It was a long time resident of Aberdeen Ferryhill from where it was withdrawn at the end of December 1962. It then went to Inverurie Works where it was broken up in September 1963. (BR Database). It was the first V2 to be withdrawn. (Rail UK).
Entering Stirling on 12th September 1961 is Black 5 45499 on an Oban to Glasgow train. This was another long term resident but at St Rollox from where it was withdrawn in August 1965. (SLS). Rail UK advises withdrawal at the end of July 1965 and thence to Motherwell Machinery & Scrap in Wishaw where it was reduced to scrap by the end of November.
Black 5 45115 entering Stirling from Glasgow for Oban on 12th September 1961. It was a St Rollox engine at the time of the photo but ended up at Hurlford from where it was withdrawn at the end of November 1966. (BR Database). It also went to Motherwell Machinery & Scrap in Wishaw where it was scrapped by the end of April 1967. (Rail UK).
Brian
First is V2 60851 at Stirling Station leaving on the St Mungo to Glasgow on 12th September 1961. It was a long time resident of Aberdeen Ferryhill from where it was withdrawn at the end of December 1962. It then went to Inverurie Works where it was broken up in September 1963. (BR Database). It was the first V2 to be withdrawn. (Rail UK).
Entering Stirling on 12th September 1961 is Black 5 45499 on an Oban to Glasgow train. This was another long term resident but at St Rollox from where it was withdrawn in August 1965. (SLS). Rail UK advises withdrawal at the end of July 1965 and thence to Motherwell Machinery & Scrap in Wishaw where it was reduced to scrap by the end of November.
Black 5 45115 entering Stirling from Glasgow for Oban on 12th September 1961. It was a St Rollox engine at the time of the photo but ended up at Hurlford from where it was withdrawn at the end of November 1966. (BR Database). It also went to Motherwell Machinery & Scrap in Wishaw where it was scrapped by the end of April 1967. (Rail UK).
Brian
