Prototype Tim Mills' Photos

[oldravendale]

Having reviewed the photos I put up yesterday it became very clear that I'd not made the best of the negatives. I've therefore done a bit more reprocessing which has mainly involved simply adding a bit of density, and in two cases a tiny bit more contrast. From my point of view it's improved the final results considerably. All these negatives are considerably under exposed and I rather overdid the corrections! Here they are again.







Brian

 

[oldravendale]

For today some further photos of Scottish subjects and some photos from the train hauled by 45115.

Princess Coronation 46226 Duchess of Norfolk at Stirling entering on a Perth to Euston train on 12th September 1961. Details of the loco are in post #1583.



This is Black 5 45115 on a Glasgow to Oban at Callendar on 12th September 1961. For details see post #1600.



Black 5 44797 entering Callendar Station on a freight train on 12th September 1961. This loco always resided at Perth South until withdrawal in September 1966. (SLS). It went to J McWilliams at Shettleston where it was scrapped by the end of the year.



View from the train between Callendar and Balquhidder on 12th September 1961. Motive power is Black 5 45115.



Another view from the train between Callendar and Balquhidder on 12th September 1961.



Yet another view from the train between Callendar and Balquhidder on 12th September 1961.



Between Callendar and Balquhidder again on 12th September 1961.



The last of the views between Callendar and Balquhidder on 12th September 1961.



Brian

 

[Simon]

2 buses on a bridge!

Brilliant pictures all, just lovely.

Simon

 

[mickoo]

44797, parcels I think not

I'm no wagon expert but I can spot a cattle wagon and three Prestflows (cement) so I highly doubt it's a parcels train.

The headcode indicates a class K :- Ballast, freight or inspection train required to stop between signal boxes or a Branch Freight train.

Class C should be parcels.

 

[LarryG]

I think they come up rather well. I too made thin negs, pushing exposures to the limit. Brian Morrison told me my negs were impossible to print haha. This is just a bit more punchy for publishing. Lovely LMS Stanier coaches with a GWR full brake leading....

 

[Martin Shaw]

Don't want to be too pedantic Brian but your missing an h, its Balquhidder. Apart from that absolutely lovely pics. There is in the pic of the V2 at Stirling a 3 doll bracket signal that lasted until about ten years ago, which is now preserved at Bo'ness, rather wish the C&O was still open though.
Martin

 

[AJC]

44797, parcels I think not

I'm no wagon expert but I can spot a cattle wagon and three Prestflows (cement) so I highly doubt it's a parcels train.

The headcode indicates a class K :- Ballast, freight or inspection train required to stop between signal boxes or a Branch Freight train.

Class C should be parcels.

Yes, it's a freight (with a carriage here treated effectively as a wagon, whether it's for parcels or simply being tripped back I couldn't say). The cattle wagon (BR standard - basically a repeat order of the last GWR Mex design) is presumably loaded, hence its position in the train while the remainder of the visible vehicles all appear to by fitted: three Presflos, four vanfits (all LMS designs going on the doors and rooflines) and an open high followed by another van. They'll be a brake at the back somewhere and, despite the superior guard's accommodation available, that's where he'd have been.

Adam

 

[oldravendale]

Thank you, Simon. I just wish Tim was here to hear those words.

Mick and Adam - mea culpa! I copied and pasted Tim's description, and even recognised it was incorrect but failed to correct it. Sadly very few of Tim's negs were ever printed so his descriptions often depend on what he could see by looking at the negs. That's no excuse for me, though. (A comment often received from those near and dear to me).

Larry - that's definitely a further improvement for which I thank you. I personally tend to prefer rather flatter images, and am also cautious about increasing contrast too far and burning out the highlights. I'm also dealing with hundreds of images so they tend to go through a rather sausage machine approach for which I really have no defence except for time.

Martin - thanks for your advice about Balquhiddher. I've simply edited the descriptions to include the missing "h" but I really don't consider your comment pedantic in the least. Let's get it right! Nice stuff about the signal at Stirling.

All comments added to the descriptions against each photo and I thank you all for your time in putting the records straight.

I'm hopeful that I may get to put some more photos up this evening.....

Brian

 

[oldravendale]

More of 45115 but this time on an Oban Train at Balquhidder on 12th September 1961.



Same loco and a view from the train at Crianlarich West between Killin and Dalmally on 12th September 1961. A double headed B1 or K4 appears from the opposite direction.



Another view from the train betwen Killin and Dalmally on 12th September 1961.



Black 5 45115 taking water at Dalmelly on 12th September 1961.



Brian

 

[AJC]

I like the last shot of Dalmelly, lots of lineside and non-loco interest, not least the GWR full brake! W193W? Not what I was expecting to see!

The visible wagons include an LMS dia. 1666, fully repainted by BR (relatively rare) and two end planks replaced with steel channel plus one post-repaint plank. The next one along is ex-LNER (six planks, barrow plank on the door).

Adam

 

[Daddyman]

B1 - no cut-out ahead of the cylinders where the footplate dips down at the front. Plus I've never seen a K1 on the Oban line. It's spelt Dalmally, by the way.

 

[JimG]

B1 - no cut-out ahead of the cylinders where the footplate dips down at the front. Plus I've never seen a K1 on the Oban line. It's spelt Dalmally, by the way.

Maybe some working from Oban to Glasgow Queen Street taking the ex NB/LNE line at Crianlarich Junction.

Jim.

 

[Overseer]

Back to the presflos at Callander, they would probably be carrying alumina from Burntisland to Fort William (or empty returns) rather than cement.

 

[mickoo]

Back to the presflos at Callander, they would probably be carrying alumina from Burntisland to Fort William (or empty returns) rather than cement.

I'll bow to the greater knowledge as generally I've no idea what traffic flows they were used for, in my day (early 80's) I only ever saw them on fly ash trains from Radcliffe ? to Fletton through Peterborough.

My interest in UK rolling stock tends to end at the rear buffers of engines it has to be said

 

[mickoo]

I'm having trouble in identifying the loco coming in the opposite direction. Is it another Black 5? Doesn't look quite right for that. Perhaps a K1?

What ever it is, it's double headed by a similar engine behind.

 

[JimG]

Brian,

I'm trying to work out where, on the C&O line between Killin Junction and Dalmally, that the picture of the train passing the double-headed B1 train could be, and with not much success. It looks as though both trains are moving and on what looks like double track line. The only lengthy bit of double track line was the loop at Crianlarich Junction and that was pretty well straight and the signal box would have been on the other side of the line. The signal box does look Caledonian but much larger than the boxes on the line, which were mainly quite small affairs and situated on the station platforms.

Can I post the picture on the Caledonian Association forum to see if anyone knows where the location might be?

Jim.

 

[Rob R]

Jim,
I'm not sure that left hand train is moving and if it's in a loop with another train passing it shouldn't be. There is some steam drifting from the safety valves but I can't see any exhauast.
Rob

 

[JimG]

Rob,

You're probably right. But I also note that there is no point rodding beside the signal wires for pointwork at the end of the loop. I was up and down the C&O between Crianlarich and Oban in the mid 60s and it was still pretty well pure Caledonian so little chance of motorised pointwork.

Jim.

 

[Oban27]

Maybe some working from Oban to Glasgow Queen Street taking the ex NB/LNE line at Crianlarich Junction.

Jim.

Hi,

as I understand it, B1's were trialled on the C&O but the crews preferred the 5's, as they experienced problems with them in the Pass of Leny.

It's possible that it is a special, a few were run using the Crianlarich chord, but it wasn't brought into regular use until the secition between Crianlarich Lower and Callender was closed, even though it was a quicker, and cheaper, route for passengers between Glasgow and Oban.

Roja

 

[oldravendale]

Loads of wonderful feedback, so thank you all.

Adam. Useful stuff about the wagons, and now you mention it W193W is indeed a long way from home.

Daddyman - thanks for confirming a B1. Duly changed as an edit to the info attached to the picture.

Thank you, Jim, for your thoughts and queries about the location. We know from earlier forays in to some of Tim's descriptions that there are errors here and there and this may well be another. Please post to the Caledonian Association to see if we can get a bit more info. As you know Tim's family are very jealous of copyright so please ensure it is credited to him - I don't have any doubt that you'll do so anyway.

Overseer - I'm aware of the Fort William association with aluminium so your proposal is very likely.

And Mick. I didn't realise the B1 was double headed but, once again, you are quite correct. I'll be adding that to an edit for the photo as well.

Rob - that's a good point. And Roja, many thanks for proposing the background to the B1 on the route.

I think that's covered all the latest stuff and thanks to you all once again.

We're still with 45115 but now on a train between Dalmelly and Connel Ferry on 12th September 1961.



Black 5 45389 on a freight leaving Connel Ferry on 12th September 1961. This was a Stirling loco from where it was withdrawn in October 1965. (SLS). It went to McLellans at Langloan where it was scrapped by the end of January 1966. (Rail UK).



Finally 57441, a McIntosh Class 711 on a freight in the station at Connel Ferry on 12th September 1961 with only two months to survive. The loco belonged to Forfar at the time from where it was withdrawn at the end of November 1961. (SLS). It went to McLellans at Coatbridge for disposal which was completed by the end of November 1962. (Rail UK).



Brian