Prototype Tim Mills' Photos

[Dave Holt]

Just look at the state of that "coal" in the tender of 2898 - a mixture of slack and ovoids, by the look, maybe the odd lump of proper coal hidden in amongst the rubbish. No doubt a bit of a challenge for the crew.
Regarding leaving the water filler lids open, although lack of care by the crews might contribute, the photos were taken in February, so it might also to be down to avoiding having the lids frozen closed and being unable to replenish vital water supplies. Was 1963 a hard winter?
Dave.

 

[Yorkshire Dave]

First is an unidentified Class 40 (or English Electric Type 4 if you prefer). Holloway Road on 5th March 1977.

This is the same class 40 (post #2212) as in post 2235.

Finally, and appropriately in this batch of photos, again at Holloway Road on 11th March 1977 is this unidentified Deltic but I think it's 55022 again, probably the shot preceding the one in post #2220.

This was taken a year before Deltics were starting to be relegated to ECML stopping services due to the introduction of the HSTs in 1978.

Very few people bothered with photos of DMUs at this time and I'm grateful to Tim for taking the trouble! Judging by the tail lamp it's going away from the camera, either towards or away from Royston.

And finally..... This was taken during the final stages of the first part of the ECML 25kV electrification - Kings Cross to Hitchin - as there are contact wires and their support brackets missing from the cross spans on the main lines. Construction was during 1976-77 to Hitchin and the section from Hitchin to Royston in 1978. The 25kV electrification also included the Hertford Loop and GN & City line to Moorgate.

 

[oldravendale]

Dave H - sad to say that was typical of the fuel being supplied to our remaining steam engines in 1963. The crews must have wondered what had happened to the "good old days". It's really not surprising that there were so many failures at the time although the new fangled diseasals were not much better and often a lot worse. Also 1963 was the worst as in coldest winter for 200 years - the sea even froze - so your surmise about the water fillers being left open may be absolutely on the ball.

Yorkie Dave. Thanks for the additional info. A bit more icing on the cake to be added to the accompanying notes. You've rather lost me with post #2122 though. That was on the WCML...

As we've seen, Tim's photography could be, let's say, somewhat variable in quality but here are some (IMHO) really good shed shots taken in what was always a difficult environment. Even in 1963 Old Oak Common was a clean and tidy shed and despite my earlier comments at appears that it still had some loco cleaners and a sense of pride in the job.

Two of Castle Class 7032 Denbigh Castle in at home in Old Oak Common Roundhouse on 24th March 1963. Previously seen in post #1138 7032 was an Old Oak Common engine throughout its life from new in 1950 - at least after an initial allocation at Swindon - and was withdrawn in September 1964 (SLS) whence it moved to Bird's, Risca where it was scrapped by early February 1965. (BR Database).





9F 92001 and Modified Hall 6990 Witherslack Hall in Old Oak Common Roundhouse on 24th March 1963. 6990 was an Old Oak engine when the photo was taken, moved around a bit before withdrawal in December 1965 (SLS) and is famously now on the GCR at Loughborough by way of Woodham Bros at Barry. 92001 wasn't so lucky It was a Tyseley engine in 1963, moving to Wakefield in November 1966 where it was withdrawn in January 1967. (SLS). It went to Cox & Danks at Wadsley Bridge for scrapping which was complete in May 1967. (BR Database).



...and Witherslack Hall alone...



Another Castle, this time 5093 Upton Castle in Old Oak Common Roundhouse on 24th March 1963. Upton Castle was at Old Oak from January 1961 until withdrawal at the end of September 1963. (SLS) It went to Swindon where it was dispatched the following month. (BR Database). Original info is in post #1179 and another picture in #1213. However it appeared later in my post #2201 which lead to a few additional comments querying the info I'd quoted, so see post #2202 by Arun Sharma and #2203 by SimonT.



Brian

 

[Yorkshire Dave]

Yorkie Dave. Thanks for the additional info. A bit more icing on the cake to be added to the accompanying notes. You've rather lost me with post #2122 though. That was on the WCML...

Since corrected, it should have read post #2212 not #2122

 

[oldravendale]

Since corrected, it should have read post #2212 not #2122

Thank you, Dave. By George, I think you've got it! It fits perfectly, particularly bearing in mind the labels in the carriage windows. I'll modify my notes accordingly... and the description attached to the photo when I get to it.

That's why I love this site. So many people will review these photos and comment. I've been able to add huge amounts of detail to very many of the pictures which had less than adequate notes attached.

Brian

 

[Arun Sharma]

Re 92001 - It was one of the few early 9Fs that were retrofitted with a double chimney. It's an engine that Tim Shackelton has described in his writings as 'deeply charismatic' - possibly because it was employed on the S&D at some stage in its life. I have an idea that later in its life it might have acquired a BR1F tender as well.

 

[Martin Shaw]

On the 26th August 1961, 92001 took ten coaches over the S&D, leaving Bath 53 mins late they arrived in Bournemouth half a minute early, truly magnificent performance by the crew and remarkable locomotives, certainly a leading contender for best steam locomotive built for use on British Railways. You're correct Arun it had a 1F tender from an unknown date but no later than Sept 64, most likely at it's Heavy Intermediate overhaul at Crewe between May and August 64.
Regards
Martin

 

[oldravendale]

Thanks, Arun and Martin. That info about 92001 certainly adds some detail which really makes the subject some alive and is now included in the description accompanying that photo.

We'll finish up the shed shots and move to the ECML today.

Hall Class 5900 Hinderton Hall stands alongside Castle 5041 Tiverton Castle and 7022 Hereford Castle in Old Oak Common Roundhouse on 24th March 1963. In 1963 Hinderton Hall was a St Philips Marsh engine being withdrawn from there in November although it had previously been a resident of Old Oak. (SLS). It went to Woodham Bros at Barry, was subsequently rescued and is now at Didcot. 5041 was on the Old Oak allocation and withdrawn from there in December 1963. (SLS). It was disposed of in June 1964 at Cashmore's, Newport. (BR Database). Finally 7022 was a Laira engine at the time, moved around a bit and was withdrawn from Gloucester Horton Road in June or July 1965. (SLS). It went to Hayes at Bridgend where it was scrapped in October the same year. (BR Database).



A4 60007 Sir Nigel Gresley backing down at Kings Cross on 26th March 1963. This was last in post #2155 when it was photographed two days after this shot. Home shed was Kings Cross at the time, moving to New England in June and then to Scotland for use on the 3 hour Aberdeen-Glasgow trains. It was withdrawn from Aberdeen Ferryhill in February 1966 and its subsequent career in preservation is well recorded elsewhere. (SLS).



And here it is again on 26th March 1963 but passing Harringay West on the 4.5 Leeds train.



Class A3 60061 Pretty Polly on a down parcels at Harringay West on 26th March 1963. Seen last in post #1954 it was a Kings Cross engine but moved to Grantham in June and was withdrawn in September. It had received trough deflectors in February 1962. (SLS). It was scrapped in October at Doncaster Works. The Railway Observer report it as being in the works yard on 6th October 1963.



Brian

 

[Roger Pound]

I enjoyed seeing 60061 'Pretty Polly'once more. I have happy recollections of this loco when it was working from Neasden in the early 1950's on the old GC line to Sheffield, not to mention it's occasional week-end sojourns away from home on shed at 38C (Leicester Central). My great regret is that I did not use my camera more in those teenage days, when one failed to envisage the imminent onset of "modernisation" and all it's ramifications..

Roger

 

[oldravendale]

I knew you'd be pleased to see another shot of Pretty Polly , Roger. Tim photographed it another three or four times so there's more to come.

For today a tale of three A4s.

Seen previously in posts #2160 and #2180 two photos at Harringay West* on 26th March 1963 and 60010 Dominion of Canada passes with the 4.21 Peterborough train. It was a Kings Cross engine and moved to New England in June then to Aberdeen Ferryhill in November where it was withdrawn at the end of May 1965. It went in to preservation at Delson, Montreal. (SLS)

Edit: *Actually Holloway Road.





60025 Falcon at Harringay West on 26th March 1963. This has featured too many times previously to list the individual posts but they can be found, should you be interested, by entering 60025 in the "Search" function. It was a Kings Cross engine at the time of this photo, moving to New England in June 1963 and being withdrawn in October the same year. (SLS). It went to Doncaster and was scrapped in early January 1964.

Edit:
It's actually Belle Isle with Gasworks tunnels in the back ground, the signals on the right are for the massive Goods & Mineral yards next to Top shed. The photo is taken from a train heading into London on the Up Main and the other train is leaving Kings X on the Down Main; 60025 is sat on the light engine relief road and will back into Kings X shortly, having come from Top shed via the Copenhagen/Belle Isle crossovers behind the photographer.

Directly behind the photographers right shoulder is Belle Isle Up signal box and those two huts with their distinctive vents are a feature of that location, as is the point rodding (with crossing boards) and gantry signal.



Finally a series of three shots of 60021 Wild Swan on the 1.15 Leeds train at Harringay West* on 26th March 1963. This is another of the A4s which has appeared several times previously. In March 1963 it was allocated to Kings Cross but not for much longer as it was moved to New England in June where it was withdrawn in October. (SLS). It was scrapped in January 1964 at Doncaster Works. (BR Database).

Edit: *Actually Holloway Road







Brian

 

[Arun Sharma]

On the 26th August 1961, 92001 took ten coaches over the S&D, leaving Bath 53 mins late they arrived in Bournemouth half a minute early, truly magnificent performance by the crew and remarkable locomotives, certainly a leading contender for best steam locomotive built for use on British Railways. You're correct Arun it had a 1F tender from an unknown date but no later than Sept 64, most likely at it's Heavy Intermediate overhaul at Crewe between May and August 64.
Regards
Martin

Thank you Martin

 

[mickoo]

60025 Falcon at Harringay West on 26th March 1963. This has featured too many times previously to list the individual posts but they can be found, should you be interested, by entering 60025 in the "Search" function. It was a Kings Cross engine at the time of this photo, moving to New England in June 1963 and being withdrawn in October the same year. (SLS). It went to Doncaster and was scrapped in early January 1964.

View attachment 190872

Brian

Brian, that's not Harringay West I'm afraid.

It's actually Belle Isle with Gaswortks tunnels in the back ground, the signals on the right are for the massive Goods & Mineral yards next to Top shed. The photo is taken from a train heading into London on the Up Main and the other train is leaving Kings X on the Down Main; 60025 is sat on the light engine relief road and will back into Kings X shortly, having come from Top shed via the Copenhagen/Belle Isle crossovers behind the photographer.

Directly behind the photographers right shoulder is Belle Isle Up signal box and those two huts with their distinctive vents are a feature of that location, as is the point rodding (with crossing boards) and gantry signal.

These are all copyright but unknown and shown for indicative purposes only.

Overall view of the Belle Isle Up location, signal box and twin cabins are evident. 60047 has crossed from the Down Main to Down Relief to enter Gasworks Tunnels. The ramp to the left is for light engines coming from Kings Cross to gain access to Top shed to the left, it also served as a goods line for freight coming up the widen lines to gain access to the goods lines going north. The large circular (LH) bore tunnel in the background is of 'Lady killers' fame.

You can also just make out the ramp the other side of the NLL bridge where light engines exited Top shed, came to a stand at the south portal of Copenhagen tunnels before backing down the relief road (seen just to the left of Belle Isle Up signal box) where they waited for access to Kings X.



Another overall view from the cab of a down train, the second cabin is just to the right out of view. The hump between the two ramped lines for access to Goods & Mineral and Top shed is clearly seen, the large gantry in the back ground featured in Lady killers. The tilted post next to the signal box had a guy wire across the down tracks to the canterlever signal post on the left.




Close up of Belle Isle Up signal box and gantry signal, Tims photo is taken exactly where the cab of 60153 is positioned in this photo.

 

[daifly]

On the 26th August 1961, 92001 took ten coaches over the S&D, leaving Bath 53 mins late they arrived in Bournemouth half a minute early, truly magnificent performance by the crew and remarkable locomotives,

A fortnight earlier it hauled at least 9 on the same route.
Dave
Near Midsomer Norton 12Aug61 (photo provenance unknown)

 

[Yorkshire Dave]

Finally a series of three shots of 60021 Wild Swan on the 1.15 Leeds train at Harringay West on 26th March 1963. This is another of the A4s which has appeared several times previously. In March 1963 it was allocated to Kings Cross but not for much longer as it was moved to New England in June where it was withdrawn in October. (SLS). It was scrapped in January 1964 at Doncaster Works. (BR Database).

These three were taken at Holloway Road, Harringay West is further north after Finsbury Park.

 

[Yorkshire Dave]

Close up of Belle Isle Up signal box and gantry signal, Tims photo is taken exactly where the cab of 60153 is positioned in this photo.

The photo was taken from the train - you can see the door hinge, handle and grab iron - probably the first or last coach depending on the direction of travel of Tim's train.



Enlarging and altering the contrast you can make out the tunnel and the arch on the lines leading to the goods depot. The road junction being behind the lattice signal post.



And taken on this stretch of line

 

[mickoo]

The photo was taken from the train - you can see the door hinge, handle and grab iron - probably the first or last coach depending on the direction of travel of Tim's train.

That's what I said in my post......

Brian, that's not Harringay West I'm afraid.

It's actually Belle Isle with Gaswortks tunnels in the back ground, the signals on the right are for the massive Goods & Mineral yards next to Top shed. The photo is taken from a train heading into London on the Up Main and the other train is leaving Kings X on the Down Main; 60025 is sat on the light engine relief road and will back into Kings X shortly, having come from Top shed via the Copenhagen/Belle Isle crossovers behind the photographer.

The train is going into Kings X and the line is slightly curved so it could be any coach.

The dialogue concerning 60153 was to orientate readers as to where Tim would have been 'on his train' taking his picture, clearly I wasn't clear enough .

 

[Yorkshire Dave]

That's what I said in my post......

I should have gone to Specsavers . What threw me off was the fact the photo of 60153 wasn't taken from a train.

 

[simond]

It is a joy to have the photos, and the discussion.

I have almost zero knowledge of the area, but thoroughly enjoy the forensic dissection.

bring it on, guys!

 

[mickoo]

I should have gone to Specsavers . What threw me off was the fact the photo of 60153 wasn't taken from a train.

I did kind of bury the pertinent information in an abundance of waffle

 

[oldravendale]

Once again I'm in your debt, Mick and Dave. I'll be changing the descriptions accordingly. In Tim's defence he'd sadly not printed many of these images before he died and he may have made a snap decision on location based on looking at other negative frames in the roll. Until you mentioned it I'd not sussed that one of the shots was from a moving train too. He took quite a lot of pictures from the train on an adjacent track and made a lot better job of it than I ever managed.

Edit: Dave, I failed to acknowledge your further info about 92001 which I'm pleased to do now.

We'll continue the ECML theme and throw in a GWR for good measure...

A3 60048 Doncaster light at Harringay West on 26th March 1963 except I think this is North Holloway. Its filthy condition labels it as a New England engine although it moved to Grantham in April, not for long though as the SLS tell us it was withdrawn in October. (SLS). However, BR Database, WHTS and Rail UK both report withdrawal on 8th September which seems more likely as appropriately it went to Doncaster Works for disposal which was completed by 19th September. Confusingly, though, WHTS reports it entering works on 19th September and being observed there on 6th October.

Edit: Confirmed as Holloway South. Loco on the up goods.



A1 60148 Aboyeur on an up Leeds & Bradford train at Harringay West (although probably North Holloway) on 26th March 1963. It's been in these pages previously, in post #2024.. It was at Leeds, Copley Hill, at the time of the photo and then moved around a bit, ending up at Gateshead from where it was withdrawn in June 1965. (SLS). By August it had been scrapped at Arnott Young, Dinsdale. (BR Database).

Edit: Confirmed as Holloway South. Train on the up main.



Another of 60148 but now at Kings Cross on the same day.



And now for the GW fix... 47XX 2-8-0 4701 in the yard at Old Oak Common on 24th March 1963. This was the same date as another shot at Old Oak in post #2208. It had been on Old Oak Common's allocation from November 1962 and is here carrying very visibly an 81A shedplate following a brief sojourn at Southall and was withdrawn in September 1963. (SLS). It went to Cashmore's, Newport for scrap which was completed in August 1965. (BR Database).



Brian