G.W.R. BLT: Almost there.

[jonte]

Hi Jonte,

I do like the fact that all this started not on the back of a fag packet, but a brown envelope ! Well done so far.

Be prepared for some minor track adjustments to suit stock, locos, clearances etc.

Steve

Thanks, Steve.

From such humble beginnings, my luck is bound to run out sooner than later as you wisely suggest, although testing with a most elongated loco - and unlikely visitor - such as an 8F has shown that I can get away with most of what I have planned, including (fingers crossed) the ubiquitous B set. That said, the jury’s out until I actually buy a set (or at least beg the loan of @Mike Garwood ‘s craftsman built version ). Only joking Mike!

Many thanks once again, Steve.

Jon

 

[Joe's Garage]

Hi Jon
I certainly enjoy the detailed photos of the construction, especially the cassette system.. Much appreciate this as I am sure I am not the only one looking at the way others do this part.
I like the wiring as it reminds me of the electronic instructions kits I used when I taught Auto electrics.
Thanks for posting and please....more.
All the best for 2023
Julian

 

[jonte]

Hi Jon
I certainly enjoy the detailed photos of the construction, especially the cassette system.. Much appreciate this as I am sure I am not the only one looking at the way others do this part.
I like the wiring as it reminds me of the electronic instructions kits I used when I taught Auto electrics.
Thanks for posting and please....more.
All the best for 2023
Julian

Hi Julian, and thank you for your interest.

I’m chuffed that an expert in the field like your good self would make such a kind remark about my ‘spaghetti’; just don’t look too closely!

I’m pleased that my poor quality photos have been of use, especially as I’m never quite sure whether I’m over-egging the pudding when uploading …..

I must admit that none of this is of my own invention, having copied it from more capable others’ after scouring the ‘net. In point of fact, it’s missing a component: a soft metal tongue to ensure electrical continuity. However, in practise, on my last attempt (Monks), I discovered that it became distorted too frequently when joining the sections, so I removed them. There was probably nothing wrong with the design, more a case of my inability to replicate exactly and/or my hamfistedness in the process.

I’ve delved into my photo album and managed to find a couple of photos to show you what I mean.

Here we see the soft metal sections which will become the ‘tongues’ (in the plastic bag to top left of picture, and which are in fact intended to hold the glass panels in a greenhouse):



And here is one of a ‘tongue’ after forming (I think I just used an off cut of wood to ‘form’, and then drilled a hole as can be seen for the holding screw, using the 4mm drills purchased for the purpose and which can be seen in the previous photo):



I’m sure somebody with your skill and knowledge could make it work, Julian. In essence, I’ve just replaced the tongues with wander leads which seems to work, and as mentioned in my earlier post, the joiners quite adequately do the job of transferring the current without any additional means, so perhaps it could just be considered over-kill after all?

Hope that helps.

Jon

 

[Roger Pound]

You may recall, Jon, that I use an identical cassette design on my (currently in limbo ) 009 gauge project. The recent discourse and revelations about anodised aluminium were indeed news to me. I bought mine some years back from B&Q - albeit it was of smaller dimensions than yours but that should not affect the issue. I never experienced any electrical trouble in operation - the cassettes were used on an earlier layout first and survived an exhibition without any operational problems. I can only assume they were not of the anodised type - undoubtedly more luck of the devil !
Respecting conductivity I would not fault the use of clips - a good and sensible alternative. I used spring-brass tongues on my cassettes which stand the wear and I would imagine it is a stronger material than the ones you originally employed on Monks were.
Once again, my congratulations on your precision and care in producing what is going to be a nice layout with so much useful information for we members of the Ten Thumbs Brigade - aka the XTB .

Roger

 

[jonte]

Hi Jonte,

I do like the fact that all this started not on the back of a fag packet, but a brown envelope ! Well done so far.

Be prepared for some minor track adjustments to suit stock, locos, clearances etc.

Steve

Hi again, Steve

Your earlier post had me doubting myself, so I conducted some further tests just to ease my mind.

I selected a Dean Goods (this will be the mainstay of the line along with a recently purchased Dukedog to which I still need to fit the chip, and which is of similar dimensions) along with my trusty 8F with it’s longer length over buffers for a more stringent test (the protruding valve gear adds a further element of difficulty). The chosen item of stock was the Hornby clerestory with its wide body and steps (it won’t see service on the layout).

Then I commenced testing around critical points including both ends of run round, the siding adjacent to runaround and the siding furthermost from the platform at the point where the line serving the head shunt lies adjacent.

Terminus end of runaround with coach stationary two inches from diverging end of point:


Same again, this time at fiddle yard end of runround:



Dean on runround with coach parked in adjacent siding at closest point:



The Dean at its closest point to coach parked on furthest siding within two inches of diverging rails:

And now the 8F at same points:



As you can see, for some reason the 8F requires the coach to be a further quarter of an inch from the diverging end of the fiddle yard runround, but with a total of 27” to play with, this should still leave enough room for a B set and a covered van consist at the platform. In addition, the loading dock siding is 21” in length which leaves also sufficient room for stock.

Phew!

jonte

Edit: apologies for mix up and not posting ‘full’ the last two photos, but for certain reasons, I had to use my phone to post which is difficult for me to navigate. Jon.

 

[jonte]

You may recall, Jon, that I use an identical cassette design on my (currently in limbo ) 009 gauge project. The recent discourse and revelations about anodised aluminium were indeed news to me. I bought mine some years back from B&Q - albeit it was of smaller dimensions than yours but that should not affect the issue. I never experienced any electrical trouble in operation - the cassettes were used on an earlier layout first and survived an exhibition without any operational problems. I can only assume they were not of the anodised type - undoubtedly more luck of the devil !
Respecting conductivity I would not fault the use of clips - a good and sensible alternative. I used spring-brass tongues on my cassettes which stand the wear and I would imagine it is a stronger material than the ones you originally employed on Monks were.
Once again, my congratulations on your precision and care in producing what is going to be a nice layout with so much useful information for we members of the Ten Thumbs Brigade - aka the XTB .

Roger

I do indeed, Roger. However, having only recently adopted this form of fiddling I cannot testify to any of it, merely relying on the accounts of others provided on various fora The info as described was helpful in as much as it encouraged me query this with the supplier, to avoid any potential pitfalls which, knowing my luck, would have proved inevitable

You’re probably right about the clips, Roger; whether brass would have been better who knows, but being a fully paid up member of the Ten Thumbs, I’d still make a pig’s ear of it

Many thanks for your kind compliments once again, Roger (‘tis deeply appreciated); if any of it’s of use to our fellow members, well that’s a bonus

Hope the glazing’s going well

Jon

 

[jonte]

I made mention in my recent post of a newly acquired Dukedog which will serve the line:



Acquired from Rails of Sheffield in early October, it’s seen here shortly after running in. Unfortunately there was a hesitation in the motion on crawl and a squeak from a tender wheel. Unconcerned by the squeal, the motion was more of an issue. Although offering to replace, I asked if Rails would examine it to see whether it could be rectified; it seemed too nice a model to waste. Thankfully they kindly agreed and the model was returned in full working order.

Whilst a factory weathered version of the model, it’s not so far gone that it will have to be removed in order for me to attempt the weathering myself.

To that end, if anybody knows where I can find a close up or two of a prototype at or near to its demise and in ‘working’ condition (for reference), I’d be extremely grateful.

jonte

 

[Roger Pound]

Regret I have no photographs, but from my ancient memories of these locos in the fifties, say ca. 1953/4, on the Cambrian in Central Wales, your model appears to be in the sort of condition these locos appeared at that time - seldom any cleaner and occasionally more weathered. Apparently withdrawals started in 1954, the bulk going in 1957 and the survivors in 1960 so it is down to what your chosen time span is to be. May I, as a freely acknowledged non-WR fan, suggest that you have a situation with this model where the old maxim of "if it ain't broke, etc.......!" applies (?).

Roger

 

[jonte]

Regret I have no photographs, but from my ancient memories of these locos in the fifties, say ca. 1953/4, on the Cambrian in Central Wales, your model appears to be in the sort of condition these locos appeared at that time - seldom any cleaner and occasionally more weathered. Apparently withdrawals started in 1954, the bulk going in 1957 and the survivors in 1960 so it is down to what your chosen time span is to be. May I, as a freely acknowledged non-WR fan, suggest that you have a situation with this model where the old maxim of "if it ain't broke, etc.......!" applies (?).

Roger

That’s very kind of you to share the wealth of your broad knowledge with me (and others) on these matters, Roger

There don’t seem to be many images around, Roger; one or two in my GWR loco book I used as a reference for my brass Finney kit build but all in b&w unfortunately

This is one of very few in colour I downloaded for reference from The Bluebell site, which I think is the more careworn condition you refer to and one which sets my juices flowing:



Unfortunately it only shows one side and is a little too distant to gauge any particular detail. Still, better than nowt!

Perhaps I should leave well alone, Roger, as you suggest, but it’s an aspect of the hobby I enjoy, even if in the main it all goes awry

But if I did, I’d start this subject with a very dilute coat of white applied with an airbrush…………

Thanks for your interest, Roger.

Jon

 

[oldravendale]

Hello Jon.

Here are two near identical images from the Tim Mills collection showing 9017 in store at Oswestry Works on 7th May 1961. Clearly the weathering will need a bit of interpretation as the photos are black & white. I suspect Tim took two photos as a result of his Irish connections - to be sure to be sure.....

These have not been seen previously. We remain at about 1500 images away from the series these came from being shown on WT.

I made a special trip to Old Oak Common Shed to see the loco when it was on its way to the Bluebell although I have no idea of the date. It had been specially cleaned up for the trip - certainly not pristine but not quite as grubby as in the Oswestry photos.

Brian

Edit - I meant to put these up as full frame pictures and not thumbnails - apologies!

 

[jonte]

Hello Jon.

Here are two near identical images from the Tim Mills collection showing 9017 in store at Oswestry Works on 7th May 1961. Clearly the weathering will need a bit of interpretation as the photos are black & white. I suspect Tim took two photos as a result of his Irish connections - to be sure to be sure.....

These have not been seen previously. We remain at about 1500 images away from the series these came from being shown on WT.

I made a special trip to Old Oak Common Shed to see the loco when it was on its way to the Bluebell although I have no idea of the date. It had been specially cleaned up for the trip - certainly not pristine but not quite as grubby as in the Oswestry photos.

Brian

Hello, Brian, and thanks for sharing.

I can use the colour photo above to compare and contrast with Tim’s B&W images to try and deduce what’s what

Many thanks and best wishes,

Jon

 

[daifly]

Does this help? 9018 at Oswestry shed 4Oct59.
Dave


Provenance unknown.

 

[isambardme]

Hi again, Steve

Your earlier post had me doubting myself, so I conducted some further tests just to ease my mind.

I selected a Dean Goods (this will be the mainstay of the line along with a recently purchased Dukedog to which I still need to fit the chip, and which is of similar dimensions) along with my trusty 8F with it’s longer length over buffers for a more stringent test (the protruding valve gear adds a further element of difficulty). The chosen item of stock was the Hornby clerestory with its wide body and steps (it won’t see service on the layout).

Then I commenced testing around critical points including both ends of run round, the siding adjacent to runaround and the siding furthermost from the platform at the point where the line serving the head shunt lies adjacent.

Terminus end of runaround with coach stationary two inches from diverging end of point:
View attachment 177615

Same again, this time at fiddle yard end of runround:

View attachment 177623

Dean on runround with coach parked in adjacent siding at closest point:

View attachment 177614

The Dean at its closest point to coach parked on furthest siding within two inches of diverging rails:View attachment 177618

And now the 8F at same points:

View attachment 177619View attachment 177620View attachment 177621

As you can see, for some reason the 8F requires the coach to be a further quarter of an inch from the diverging end of the fiddle yard runround, but with a total of 27” to play with, this should still leave enough room for a B set and a covered van consist at the platform. In addition, the loading dock siding is 21” in length which leaves also sufficient room for stock.

Phew!

jonte

Edit: apologies for mix up and not posting ‘full’ the last two photos, but for certain reasons, I had to use my phone to post which is difficult for me to navigate. Jon.

Great testing photos Jonte. Do be aware that when you are actually playing with the layout ( sorry, operating !), there is a chance you may forget the key potential crunch points, especially if talking to visitors etc. Perhaps some key points could be marked by something, like a workman, piece of litter etc.
Just a thought.
Good luck with it all,

Steve

 

[jonte]

Great testing photos Jonte. Do be aware that when you are actually playing with the layout ( sorry, operating !), there is a chance you may forget the key potential crunch points, especially if talking to visitors etc. Perhaps some key points could be marked by something, like a workman, piece of litter etc.
Just a thought.
Good luck with it all,

Steve

Thanks, Steve.

Jon

 

[jonte]

Does this help? 9018 at Oswestry shed 4Oct59.
Dave
View attachment 177749

Provenance unknown.

It does indeed, Dave

My sincerest thanks.

Jon

 

[Joe's Garage]

These are very nice photos of Dukedogs and the one thing that strikes me is the sheen on the lower part of the loco. It is as though someone has sprayed WD40 across the underframe, not rusty like the front end of the other loco glimpsed in Daifly's photo at Oswestry. Is it an effect of the light or were they oiled and greased more due to the outside bearings?
Lovely photos especially as they are rare.
Julian

 

[jonte]

These are very nice photos of Dukedogs and the one thing that strikes me is the sheen on the lower part of the loco. It is as though someone has sprayed WD40 across the underframe, not rusty like the front end of the other loco glimpsed in Daifly's photo at Oswestry. Is it an effect of the light or were they oiled and greased more due to the outside bearings?
Lovely photos especially as they are rare.
Julian

An interesting observation, Julian, although I’m probably the least qualified to comment.

I agree, the photos are wonderfully atmospheric.

Best,

Jon

 

[jonte]

Before I move on from the fiddleyard, I’d just like to show you the new, longer, leads in place:



…..and share my rather low-tech solution to prevent stock running off into the abyss whilst manoeuvring the cassettes (especially these longer two, although smaller ones for shunting are in the offing):



jonte

 

[Alan]

Pan scourers are very useful.

 

[jonte]

Pan scourers are very useful.

The bonus, Alan, is that they can be adjusted to the length of any stock.

Jon