7mm MK1 Brake Goods

[farnetti]

Haven't posted here for ages. The BG is almost complete, I put off doing the underframe end detail stuff, especially the fine chains, as I thought it might be tricky but in the end it was fine.

Just got to do the brake linkage to the bogies and the end handrails.

I was going to post some photos but I have re-installed W7 as W10 was causing me too many time consuming problems. I cannot remember what photo resizer software I had, what do others use?

Also have nearly finished the build I am thinking about the painting. I cannot find any info on t'internet or Keith Parkins' book about the interior colours early 1960's. I suspect the roof was an ivory colour, sides and ends possibly either grey or red, and the floor seems to be a mix of metal panels and wood so I have no idea. Any knowledge gratefully appreciated.

Ken

 

[SimonT]

Try Irfanview and I am about to put W7 back on too!
Simon

 

[farnetti]

Thank you Simon, I'm back in business.

Two photos of the nearly finished item, spurred on by Heathers' thread (Ta very much).








It looks like I need to tweak the guards bottom step, worse on the other side as it broke from the upper while bending, it will get sorted. The roof is not fixed down hence the small gap at the cantrails, nor is the interior yet fitted.

I am toying with the idea of using thin wire to represent the fine chain used to attach the electrical socket too a small tethering seen halfway down below the lamp bracket. The only thing really left to do are the end handrails and redo the roof handrails (which I removed due to my incorrect profile).

The interior needs painting before final assembly, hence my plea for interior colours. Keith Parkins MK1 book only has a B& W photo, nothing on the internet, even the Beatles Hard Days Night scene was in B&W.

Ken

 

[oldravendale]

even the Beatles Hard Days Night scene was in B&W.

Ken

My wife was in the film and in that carriage. I'll ask her, but I suspect she was thinking of other matters at the time.

Brian

 

[Heather Kay]

I think there's colour references in the Parkin supplement. I'll try to dig it out for you tomorrow. It'll be nice to see another MMP Mk1 finished!

 

[farnetti]

I think there's colour references in the Parkin supplement. I'll try to dig it out for you tomorrow. It'll be nice to see another MMP Mk1 finished!

Many thanks Heather, but it doesn't seem to cover the interiors of goods areas. Unless any other appears I might just have go for cream sides, black ironmongery and dirty scuffed grey/brown floors.

Anyway, the chassis finished I primed it to today. I don't think the photos add anything but here they are.

They were done in etched grey primer and then black primer. On to the handrails then, I look for to them with trepidatation.

Ken

 

[djparkins]

On to the handrails then, I look for to them with trepidatation.

Ken

Ken - just put on 'Blacklight' and get on with it!!!

Re- the interior - don't you have some idea from the photos in the instructions? IIRC - and perhaps Bob can confirm this - Humbrol used to do both Light & Dark Interior Stone in their range. You can see where the demarcation would be from the photo in the instructions. These might be the colours but I would obviously defer to Bob on this one.

The floor would, I imagine, be darkish grey [very similar to RAF Dark Sea Grey] for the plain areas with wood colour for the planked sections - but again, perhaps Bob could confirm.

Regards

DJP/MMP

 

[richard carr]

Ken

The coach looks great.

I wouldn't worry too much about the internal colours as nobody can remember what they were. The only thing I can say with certainty was that the interiors were dirty everywhere.

Richard

 

[Peter Insole]

Ken, my understanding is that the interiors of passenger brakes were always "Wagon Bauxite" from floor to ceiling and the guards compartment was cream (possibly a light sand shade?). One thing that is certain, in the blue era the whole kit and caboodle was covered with that 'orrible, dreary grey!

 

[Bob Reid]

I remember it much as Peter does - the drawings for the Gangwayed Brake Vans are sparse on colour information for interior painting which was generally confined to the vehicle paint spec's. I did find though the paint specified for the exterior gangway doors in the later maroon era i.e. Circa 1964 which is given as (Both BS2660) Buff – Ref 3-041 or alternatively Cream - Ref 4-054 (Circa 1964) - as with all things BR they had there own paint names, for the present day lists give these as 3-041 (Maple) and 4-054 (Mimosa Yellow)....! If you can hang fire for a short while, I can check the maroon paint spec and any other BG drawings I have for any other references to the specific colours used.

As for the floors - when they were first laid or replaced in the van, it was a less than subtle light salmon pink colour - though within a few weeks it quickly turned to grey as David points out.

 

[farnetti]

Thanks to all for your help on the interior colours. Bob, thanks for the offer but don't waste time, I tend to agree with Richard and you won't be able to see much of anyway. I just wanted to get basic side colour correct as well as the Guards compartment which I can now do.

David, I haven't listened to that for a couple of months, I shall give it a go.

Ken

 

[Bob Reid]

No problem Ken - Spec. gives;

Guard's Compartment Walls (floor to cornice including cupboards - Stone Colour finishing paint to BR Spec 32A item 20.
Luggage Compartment and Corridor, Walls and Ends - Red finishing paint to BR Spec 32A item 32
Luggage Compartment Screens - Red finishing paint to BR Spec 32A item 32
Chalking Panels on Doors and Walls - Black Sealer/Undercoat to BR Spec 40 item 27
Periscope, Heater Pipes etc. - Black Sealer/Undercoat to BR Spec 40 item 27
Ceilings and Area's above cornice - White to BR Spec 32A Item 26

A copy of BR specification 32A would identify the nearest BS equivalent - anyone? Apparently item 20 was B.S. 381C 361 Light Stone.

 

[farnetti]

Guard's Compartment Walls (floor to cornice including cupboards - Stone Colour finishing paint to BR Spec 32A item 20.
Luggage Compartment and Corridor, Walls and Ends - Red finishing paint to BR Spec 32A item 32
Luggage Compartment Screens - Red finishing paint to BR Spec 32A item 32
Chalking Panels on Doors and Walls - Black Sealer/Undercoat to BR Spec 40 item 27
Periscope, Heater Pipes etc. - Black Sealer/Undercoat to BR Spec 40 item 27
Ceilings and Area's above cornice - White to BR Spec 32A Item 26

Thank you very much Bob, that gives a really good sense of how it should look.

So after fitting the new front and back doors on the house build tomorrow I'll be off to Buffers near Axminster to see what colours I can find, they stock Humbrol and Railmatch.

I'll post a photo of the interior after painting

Ken

 

[michael080]

I'll post a photo of the interior after painting

Ken, I just discovered this thread.
Sadly, it is just stopping short of the final pictures. Did you finish this project?

As I am also bulding a MMP MK1-BG, your information is very useful. The same applies of course to Heathers thread https://www.westernthunder.co.uk/index.php?threads/building-an-mmp-rmb-a-box-of-delights.2987/ building a MK1-RMB.

I want to take the opportunity to thank all Western Thunders for supplying this valuable information to other modellers. This input makes WT so special!

Michael

 

[farnetti]

I have just about finished it, I sprayed the body last summer but was not happy with the result and stripped it again, then house moving got in the way. Will try again when new little workshop is built and the weather is warmer.

Let me know if I can be of any help.

Ken

 

[76043]

A copy of BR specification 32A would identify the nearest BS equivalent - anyone? Apparently item 20 was B.S. 381C 361 Light Stone.

This 32A and 32B spec document seems to be as rare as hen's teeth. Surely it can't be so!
Tony

 

[Bob Reid]

Seems to be Tony, all these years down the line and no one seems able to find the Spec and the associated docs that went with it Maybe one day

 

[AndyB]

I can't be certain, but possibly even if a copy of Spec 32 was found it wouldn't help with the actual colours or equivalents.
Spec 81 ("Paints for Rolling Stock"), first issued in 1984, referred the reader to colour panels, such as this example page:

So even by the 1980s, colours had no cross-references to BS numbers, RAL, etc.
Another point to note - there is no specification Identified for how to do the visual inspection for colour (usually within BR, cross-references to standards and specifications abound, where they exist). Which suggests to me that it was highly influenced by the lighting conditions under which the inspection took place - even to the most trained eye.

Andy

 

[76043]

Well, spec 32A apparently does contain BS colour references, according to this post.

Featurette #3 BR Goods Vehicle Paint Schemes

The most asked question received in our inbox relates to the specific colour of our vehicles, BR was very good at cataloging items within their own numbering system so looking through any BR docume…

quornwagonandwagon.co.uk

Unfortunately the person who posted it is no longer involved at Quorn and nobody has the document.

BS references are in the BR corporate identity manual, well before the 80's. Sections 1/30 published in 1969 and 1974 clearly state BS colour colour references.

http://www.doublearrow.co.uk/manual/1_30.1969-01.gif

http://www.doublearrow.co.uk/manual/1_30.1974-11.gif

Now what happened on the ground is very different, workshop practice and the like, so this is not meant to reflect what actually happened, read the Quorn webpage on BR warning yellow for example.

However, it's clear BR at a high level did specify BS colours and this for me is interesting.

I'm thinking of asking the NRM if they have a copy of 32A.
Tony