7mm Mickoo's Commercial Workbench

[mickoo]

Little update on the ROD frames, the first thing you'll notice is that there's no provision for jogging the frames, then you'll notice the frame profile is not quite correct, it should be flat across the top and 2 mm lower. I can see why it's been done as it includes the rear of the splasher but I want those as part of the body section.

The dropped section between the leading and 1st intermediate axle should be straight across as well, the kit does add a piece to the footplate to represent this but the motion bracket just creeps up into this area so you're left with a bit of a gap/juggling between it and the pseudo frames on the footplate, plus there's some oil pots on the inside face that need adding.

Ordinarily I'd solder a blanking plate in but adding the jog will split the joint easily so it was a case of silver soldering, I didn't try to be smart and just flooded it with paste and set to with the big flame. It took a few minutes to clean up and then form the jog, there's still a bit of surface imperfection to dress out but it's workable and onto fitting the axle box guides.

These are formed from 1x1 mm angles each side of the axle box and a 1x2 mm bit across the top to hold the adjustment screw and nut. Over the top of all goes the cosmetic 3D prints.

Modified above, original below.









I accept I'll probably have to cut a new footplate to follow the jogged profile but I feel it's worth as this area and the inside of the frames are quite visible on the finished model. I'll only be using the rear stay and part of the front one (modified) the rest will be new etched ones with slightly better profiles and fixing flanges etc.

 

[Genghis]

The newer kits have a completely modified set of frame etches, but I doubt if they follow the correct profile at the top.

David

 

[mickoo]

The newer kits have a completely modified set of frame etches, but I doubt if they follow the correct profile at the top.

David

Good news

I can see why these were done this way and the extension on the footplate has a jog in it so above the frames everything looks fine, I just wanted the bit below to match. I'm not sure how much the frame jog will show on the finished model and I suspect I'll have made a rod for my own back with the slide bar motion brackets which will need tweaking I suspect.

 

[Dave Holt]

Seems a rather strange arrangement to have the frame joggle between two of the coupled axles, with the resulting difference in clearance to the backs of the wheels between the front axle and the rest. Presumably there was a good reason on the full sized locos.
Dave.

 

[Genghis]

I have a feeling that the jog is missed. I think that Dibateg inserted one into his build. Probably need to add a further redraw to the 'To-Do' list.

 

[mickoo]

I have a feeling that the jog is missed. I think that Dibateg inserted one into his build. Probably need to add a further redraw to the 'To-Do' list.

It works either way but the jog is about 1mm offset over 5mm of frame length which means the leading axle hole has to move forward about 0.3 mm. You’d have to draw it in CAD to get a precise alignment but o can get the two frame widths off the GA if you need them.

I don’t think Tony added the jog, there was some discussion at the time but he decided against it, I need to re-read it to see what else he did. Nick did one several years ago and jogged the frames but then had to adjust the footplate with extensions to close the gap.

 

[mickoo]

Seems a rather strange arrangement to have the frame joggle between two of the coupled axles, with the resulting difference in clearance to the backs of the wheels between the front axle and the rest. Presumably there was a good reason on the full sized locos.
Dave.

It all look as the leading axle more side play and reduces the minimum curvature the engine can transit. I suppose that would be handy under wartime conditions and allow greater access to more track work.

Normally the leading coupling rod would have a spherical bearing or equivalent to allow side play.

 

[warren haywood]

Are those the 3'-6" spring ones? What did the 3'-0" ones go on in the end?

This lot

 

[mickoo]

Now that's an impressive collection

I've got three to deliver for paint at Guildford so leave some space in the boot for them

I was hoping to have four/five but real life just keeps getting in the way

 

[Phil Atkinson]

Hi Mick, sorry but for personal reasons, it has taken me quite a few weeks to read most of your 126 pages.
I like very much to work that you do, and have mainly similar thoughts on a lot of what you do. So much so that I am about to order a 3D printer, but still have a few questions.

What resin do you use and why. I understand there are lots of type/makes and mixing is possible, but which do find best for the sort of products you are printing. Are you using that one for detail, for stability, strength or what.

I'm currently working on another super detail kit, a LNWR coach primally for my self, as I nee few but it has been on the board for a few years now and the design at this late stage would be difficult to make a mechanical fixing of 3D to the under frame. However what I have found is that although your customer and like minded people on WA want a lot more fidelity and detail, it does not appear so with wagons and coaches. My last kit was a PO wagon based on the superb resin casings sold via HMRS, mastered by Paul Clarke. The underframe I dis had working drawbar springs, working axlebox springs.
The brake push rods had the correct angle to wheel tyre. Even the timbers had to be cut away if using 32mm gauge wheels. The interest was small to say the least. But it has not stopped me and have plans for other items. So keep up the good work. You inspire me .

Regards Phil

 

[mickoo]

Phil,

I use Sirayatech Fast Navy Grey (FNG), simply because that's the go to resin if you want detail with some strength. Big Train James put me onto it when I switched from the Form and other than two bottles (introduction reduction price) of Elegoo 8K or some such have only used FNG.

I used the 8K as a back up when FNG runs out and the new lot hasn't arrived yet, it's similar to FNG but softer so you get a slightly smoother surface but it's more prone to warping and pressure waves as it's more flexible.

You can mix and I've heard of lots of formulas but frankly just do not have the time to experiment, the machine goes pretty much flat out and I'm on the tipping point of getting a second, this week and next I really need two machines, last week I had a bit of slack and only needed one.

Hope that helps.

 

[simond]

Phil,

this thread may help.

3D Printing - whether to buy, what to buy and how to use it?

Following John Baker’s kind offer to 3D print the tanks for my model, I’m really intrigued by the process & possibilities. John uses an Elegoo printer, I’m interested to know what others have, what their impressions are, etc. I am seriously tempted! Also, the process, there seems to be a...

www.westernthunder.co.uk

best
Simon

 

[Phil Atkinson]

Phil,

I use Sirayatech Fast Navy Grey (FNG), simply because that's the go to resin if you want detail with some strength. Big Train James put me onto it when I switched from the Form and other than two bottles (introduction reduction price) of Elegoo 8K or some such have only used FNG.

I used the 8K as a back up when FNG runs out and the new lot hasn't arrived yet, it's similar to FNG but softer so you get a slightly smoother surface but it's more prone to warping and pressure waves as it's more flexible.

You can mix and I've heard of lots of formulas but frankly just do not have the time to experiment, the machine goes pretty much flat out and I'm on the tipping point of getting a second, this week and next I really need two machines, last week I had a bit of slack and only needed one.

Hope that helps.

Mick

Yes - Thank you very much - Printer + resin ordered.

I have used full blown Autocad for 20 years but never 3D so another steep learning curve to get over.

As a LNWR modeller, can't wait the next stage of your LNWR build.

Phil

 

[Phil Atkinson]

Phil,

this thread may help.

3D Printing - whether to buy, what to buy and how to use it?

Following John Baker’s kind offer to 3D print the tanks for my model, I’m really intrigued by the process & possibilities. John uses an Elegoo printer, I’m interested to know what others have, what their impressions are, etc. I am seriously tempted! Also, the process, there seems to be a...

www.westernthunder.co.uk

best
Simon

Hi Simon

I found that a few weeks ago and read every page thanks

Just wanted Mick's view before I started to spend lots of money trying differing resins

Phil

 

[simond]

Very wise. I did exactly the same thing!

 

[mickoo]

Mick

Yes - Thank you very much - Printer + resin ordered.

I have used full blown Autocad for 20 years but never 3D so another steep learning curve to get over.

As a LNWR modeller, can't wait the next stage of your LNWR build.

Phil

LNWR 2-4-2T chassis etches arrived late last week and I'll get back to that once the ROD and 850 are completed, hopefully in a few weeks.

 

[Big Train James]

I have used full blown Autocad for 20 years but never 3D so another steep learning curve to get over.

Hi Phil,
I'm also a long-time Autocad user, and have been using it for 3d modeling now since about 2015. Using it for 3d really isn't all that different than for 2d, instead of stretching you push/pull, instead of trimming you slice, same osnaps, etc etc. It's an oversimplification of course, but it's easier to get up to speed if you are already fluent with the 2d functionality. Probably the trickiest thing is getting used to manipulating the UCS, and understanding it's effect on any number of operations in 3d.

I can certainly help if you have questions about 3d in Autocad. I've done some tutorial videos in the past like this one on the UCS topic, so we can either sort through things in print or try a video if that's more clear.

Jim

 

[dibateg]

I did consider joggling the frames on my O4 build, I investigated it and decided against! For a working loco on Basford North, I decided that the visual difference would just not be noticed - except that everyone now knows its not been done!


I'm looking forward to further instalments of your build Mick,

Regards
Tony

 

[mickoo]

More Gladiator ROD, still bumbling along with the chassis.

First though a correction concerning the frames, I cut 2 mm off the top and filled the gap between the 1st and 2nd axles. That was the wrong thing to do, the height was correct and all I needed do was fill the gap, I mistook the wrong reference line on the GA so needed to add the 2 mm back along the top in one piece. Just to set the record straight.

The rest of the time was spent on the brakes and cylinder blocks, sadly the cylinder blocks are from an age long gone and really needed something a little more modern. There are a quite a few recesses in the rear face to clear brake hangers and shoes and replicating all that in brass would be a chore. The end result was more Lego

despite many bags of white metal parts I couldn't find anything that looked remotely like the pressure relief valves or drain cocks so ended up scratch building new ones, luckily they are simple globe valve types and easy to scratch build. The linkages are on an etch going out first thing next week. The pressure relief valves will have to wait until next week and time at the lathe.

There are no fixings for the two sets of leading sand pipes so you need to add a plate with corresponding hole in the right place, the trailing one has a fixing at the bottom of the frame but nothing at the top, again another plate keeps it all neat and tidy and adds extra strength.

The valve chest is in the Lego making machine right now, hopefully done by 01:00, quick clean and scoosh of paint before fitting tomorrow as I head out the door to Guildford.

The pony truck needs the bearing casting and swing links adding as they can be seen easily from low angles, also the outside axle boxes, springs, droppers and secondary springs need drawing up and fitting to bulk out that area.

There's an extra stay to go in where the slot is mid frame, that'll be in the machine overnight and hopefully ready to fit before I leave; that'll leave the reversing weigh shaft trunnions and the motion bracket, that'll be an etch to help tie the frames together and add rigidity as well as support the valve rods at the tail end.

 

[Genghis]

I feel another conversation coming on................