HO Eureka Heights (SP) Houston

Focalplane

Western Thunderer
EDIT: new thread title reflects ongoing subtle changes to concept brought about by research.

My parallel thread, Southern Pacific Remembered, has prompted me to bring out much of my HO stock and to think about what could be done with it without spending too much money and also to do it away from the Gauge O Railway Room in France. This is particularly so because of the Schengen 90/180 day rule means I have to leave France once the 90 day stay nears completion.

The photos I am collating of the SP, plus help from Google Street View in reminding me of certain places I last visited over 20 years ago, have given me an idea.

SP lines radiated in all directions from Houston and one I was particularly keen on was the north west line out to Hempstead and ultimately Dallas/Fort Worth. My office for many years was off the Hempstead Highway. This was before the building of US 290, to freeway standards. Hempstead Highway left Houston as Hempstead Road, quite close to the old MKT yard at Eureka. The multilevel Loop 610 was built over it and also the SP main line which paralleled the road for a considerable distance, offset on the southwestern side and serving numerous industry sidings. I can certainly remember short pickup dropdown freights with a GP switching mainly box cars. It would appear that today many of these sidings have gone, but this screen grab from Street View illustrates my idea better than the proverbial 1000 words.

Screen Shot 2022-07-10 at 3.10.49 PM.png

What the camera saw just 2 months ago includes a grade crossing (plenty of those in Houston) with the main line on the left and a loop siding on the right. It is this loop that provided the time and space for a pickup freight to operate. The various sidings would bear off down between low level warehouses and workshops. The streets in the area are generally on a NS/EW grid, so the NW-SE highway and SP main line required only a 45º turn from the loop. Unfortunately many of these sidings have been lifted but they are still shown on some satellite images, etc.

In addition to the pickup freight loop, there were also loops on the other side of the main line. In my days there, these loops could hold trains but were also used as storage for wagons holding plastic pellets until they were needed. Someone out there could help me by naming what these specialized wagons are called! I am more of a box car freak!

So, what plan could use all this information? Either a roundy round or a dumbell, I suppose, with passenger trains and fast fitted freights using the main line and secondary trains using the loops. Operations would be enhanced by switching box cars in and out of the sidings. But it could start just as a shunting plank, perhaps using a standard 6ft x 2ft module.

Ironically I only have main line steam locomotives at my disposal and only an SD-7 diesel would look at home on a pickup freight, so I need a steam switcher. The search is on! The other irony is that Texas never saw some of the illustrious California based 4-8-4s and 4-8-2s and Cab in Front articulateds were also confined to the Western Divisiions. So we may need a big Rule 1 here! The main line was used by two named trains, the Sunbeam and Owl, day and night trains to/from Dallas, but the motive power was limited to Pacifics (3 of which were streamline cased and painted in Daylight colours). Some imagination will be needed!

Here's an attempt at a satellite image captured:

Screen Shot 2022-07-10 at 3.46.18 PM.png
 
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Focalplane

Western Thunderer
True, wagons is the wrong term, been away from Texas for nearly 20 years! I think covered hoppers would be the correct term. I once had a strong Texas accent (I talked real slow) but that has been erased. Best to fit in if you can,
 

Jordan

Mid-Western Thunderer
Well, an F7 is known as a covered wagon!
Only as a nickname. Anyway this is all just a distraction from the OP....

So, what plan could use all this information? Either a roundy round or a dumbell, I suppose, with passenger trains and fast fitted freights using the main line and secondary trains using the loops. Operations would be enhanced by switching box cars in and out of the sidings. But it could start just as a shunting plank, perhaps using a standard 6ft x 2ft module.
An excellent idea, I think. My own main layout is essentially just a siding & three spurs (passing loop and three sidings in English) off an oval of track, and gives me enough absorbing operation as I want, albeit it's a different context & Era to the OP the principle is the same.
It's easy to fall into the mindset that interesting operation depends on complex track plans. It's equally difficult to put faith in the "less is more" principle, until you actually try it!! :)
 

Focalplane

Western Thunderer
The next question is “What era?” Well, I only lived in Houston from 1980 to 2003 and diesels from that era don’t get me excited (particularly SP trains, sadly).

To me, two of the best British steam loco designs were influenced by American practice, the Ivatt 2MT and 4MT. Having everything exposed and accessible was a design feature that went back to the 1900s in North America. So any SP switcher that lasted to the 1950s would be appropriate. This would fit in with my coaching stock which is mostly post war. The boxcars would have to fit in so some selection as to time of manufacture would be used

For diesel days, more modern freight cars could be added. My SD7 and F7s are in Black Widow colours so fit in to to end of steam transition as do the large steam engines. My 2 E8s are in Daylight colours, again perfect for the transition era.

So early 1950s it is!
 

Yorkshire Dave

Western Thunderer
To me, two of the best British steam loco designs were influenced by American practice, the Ivatt 2MT and 4MT. Having everything exposed and accessible was a design feature that went back to the 1900s in North America.

It was the S160 which came over in WWII which lead to the design influences on the BR standard classes.

006.jpg

007.jpg
008.jpg

The above was extracted from this book - which is an interesting read in it's own right if you can locate a copy.

005.jpg

Apologies - digression over. Back to layouts :)
 

Focalplane

Western Thunderer
No need to apologize! There are many reasons why some people model a foreign to them railway/railroad. I liked Fleischman and Roco at one time but sold them in Houston to buy local stuff. Likewise my contact at FB Systems in southern France loves North American trains (being HO there is that common feature, of course).

If I show the first photo again:

Screen Shot 2022-07-10 at 3.10.49 PM.png

There are several features I missed the first time around. On the loop line you can make out where a RH turnout has been replaced, not only by the ties/sleepers, but also there is good evidence that this turnout lead to another, feeding two sidings. Look to the right of the D sign.

And beyond the loop there is another one! I am sure a careful study of Street View could yield a mountain of information, present and past. I also mentioned that the highway parallels the SP main line for a considerable distance. Basically this is true as far as Hempstead, a distance of nearly 50 miles. At Hempstead the line makes a sharp right turn towards Dallas and road and rail part company.

For a while, around 1995, the southbound Texas Eagle divided at Dallas, with two coaches heading down this line to Houston. It was Houston's link to Chicago. For a short time only. Southwest Airlines basically put an end to it (and also the short lived proposal for high speed trains between Houston, Dallas, Austin and San Antonio).
 

Focalplane

Western Thunderer
I found this photo on line, attributed to Roger S. Plummer and taken on August 9, 1953.

SunbeamHouston1953.jpg

It shows the Sunbeam leaving Houston Grand Central for Dallas. The now demolished station building (referenced in my parallel thread) is above the locomotive, which is one of the 3 pacifics modified and streamlined for the Sunbream service. The Downtown area is off to the right while the tracks at the other end of the station head off to New Orleans. Of the 8 platforms visible only one remains. EDIT With my second copy of the Dunscomb reference book to hand I can confirm the three locos were class P-14, they were converted from P-6s. They were one of the last streamline steam locos to be placed in service. The tenders are standard Vanderbilt design.

The Sunbeam pacifics were unique and painted in Daylight colours. The front coach appears to be silver/red in this photo though most SP posters of the day showed the entire train as coloured Daylight. This is quite a rare photo, showing both train and the trackside elements of the now demolished station.

I think there may have been a brass HO model but usually the Daylight colour scheme is portrayed only on GS class, a couple of MT-4s and a couple of A-6 Atlantics. Someone even released a cab forward model in Daylight colours, which was a "bit of a stretch"!
 
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Focalplane

Western Thunderer
I just let out some news on another thread so mention should be made here.

I have selected an SP 0-6-0 switcher from brasstrains.com and it’s on its way. Photos when it arrives.

Clearly this suggests some intent to at least start a shunting plank based on the above posts. Though I won’t start until October at the earliest. The switcher needs some work and will include modification to a Houston shopped S-14 class loco. It will also need DCC sound.
 

Focalplane

Western Thunderer
I have sourced a P-14 streamlined pacific in unpainted brass but the price is a bit steep and with additional import costs even more so. It also will need some work, including a new can motor, but it would look good running down from Hempstead into Houston in charge of the Sunbeam. The P-14s were replaced by Alco PAs in the early 1950s but a nice A+B set could cost more than the upgraded P-14, so it needs some thought*. Again, the rake of passenger cars is already in stock. Having the pickup freight in the siding while the daily streamliner whisks by would be a good sight,

* By the time I finish thinking, the P-14 will probably have been sold!
 

Focalplane

Western Thunderer
Back to the S class 6 wheel switcher. Diebert and Strapac have some interesting data about one of the the Houston S-13 Class switchers. Built in 1921 by Baldwin as T&NO number 146, it was “sold” to the SP in 1952 and renumbered 1297. Another 3 S-13s went west with it.

Sorting through my photos is this one of 1297 at Ogden, where it ended up at the museum!

DDE0C2C2-4330-49F6-853D-35BA1902A56F.jpeg

So, a search for the preserved locomotive yielded this. Utahrails.net - “SP 1297 was built as Texas & New Orleans Railroad 146; renumbered to SP 1297 (2nd) on June 10, 1952; retired by SP at Bayshore, California on October 2, 1957; donated to City of Ogden, Utah, on September 30, 1958; displayed with UP 0-6-0 4436 at Affleck Park; moved to Ogden Union Station in 1993; sold in July 2002 to Bollack Electromechanical Museum, Farmington, New Mexico after being declared surplus in Ogden; moved from Ogden on July 10, 2002, arriving in Farmington on July 12.”

Then a search for Bollack, showed the name was misspelled, should be Bolack, and their Tripadvisor web site has photos of the loco restored (cosmetically, I think) back to its T&NO number:

A2FD738E-8F2F-4C59-992F-66543E7CB26B.jpeg
 

mickoo

Western Thunderer
I have sourced a P-14 streamlined pacific in unpainted brass but the price is a bit steep and with additional import costs even more so. It also will need some work, including a new can motor, but it would look good running down from Hempstead into Houston in charge of the Sunbeam. The P-14s were replaced by Alco PAs in the early 1950s but a nice A+B set could cost more than the upgraded P-14, so it needs some thought*. Again, the rake of passenger cars is already in stock. Having the pickup freight in the siding while the daily streamliner whisks by would be a good sight,

* By the time I finish thinking, the P-14 will probably have been sold!
Rarity has it's price, the real conundrum is 'will I regret not getting it'.

Given it's rarity, you may never get the chance again, I've made that mistake a few times, penny pinching to ease the soul, only to spend months later agonizing over the loss.

One other way to look at it, import brass rarely looses it's value, if needs must, you can move it on; you may never recuperate the shipping and import taxes or your full purchase price but you'll put a large chunk of it back in the bank, can't say that for many hobbies I know of.
 

mickoo

Western Thunderer
Back to the S class 6 wheel switcher. Diebert and Strapac have some interesting data about one of the the Houston S-13 Class switchers. Built in 1921 by Baldwin as T&NO number 146, it was “sold” to the SP in 1952 and renumbered 1297. Another 3 S-13s went west with it.

Sorting through my photos is this one of 1297 at Ogden, where it ended up at the museum!

View attachment 166925

So, a search for the preserved locomotive yielded this. Utahrails.net - “SP 1297 was built as Texas & New Orleans Railroad 146; renumbered to SP 1297 (2nd) on June 10, 1952; retired by SP at Bayshore, California on October 2, 1957; donated to City of Ogden, Utah, on September 30, 1958; displayed with UP 0-6-0 4436 at Affleck Park; moved to Ogden Union Station in 1993; sold in July 2002 to Bollack Electromechanical Museum, Farmington, New Mexico after being declared surplus in Ogden; moved from Ogden on July 10, 2002, arriving in Farmington on July 12.”

Then a search for Bollack, showed the name was misspelled, should be Bolack, and their Tripadvisor web site has photos of the loco restored (cosmetically, I think) back to its T&NO number:

View attachment 166924
Timely, do you, or anyone, have a loco diagram for the S10 - 14 switchers.

I've got a lot of them but the ones I've hoovered off the web stop at MT, no P, S, SE, SP, T, TW.

I'm not after the erecting diagrams (though they would be nice but I don't think they're available unless you manage to pull one from the Locomotive Cyclopedias somewhere) but the locomotive diagrams like below.

Locos of SP C-19,19a.jpg

The book (yes I'd like one) is hellish expensive but there are DVD pdf's on the web cheap as chips, I've ordered one but right now was just hoping to do a quick cross reference twixt S10-14 and USRA 0-6-0 and work out how much effort is needed to convert it to SP Lines instead of UP.
 

Focalplane

Western Thunderer
Well, Mick, I can’t help you with the loco diagrams, but you have convinced me and the P-14 has been ordered. I think my initial reluctance was based on it being a +/- 1970 model. I owned a Balboa GS4 once and its finish left something to be desired. That being said the P-14 really is quite a simple brass casing (and most unusual) so the deal is done. I had to replace the Balboa’s motor etc. so expect to do the same.

Photos when it arrives!
 

mickoo

Western Thunderer
Don't knock 70's brass imports, they're not all bad and make a good basis for detailing if you choose so.

Granted it's O gauge and not HO but for a mid 70's model this Big Boy was not too shabby.

IMG_0250.jpg

Besides, from your descriptions of the Daylight swooping in and swooshing through, uber detail might be lost and not worth the effort.

Here's another thought, are there better alternatives out there, not necessarily cheaper, but better? Sometimes you just have to get what you can get.

I'm eyeing up a PSC SP Pacific, it's at the top end of the price spectrum from a dealer and TAX + postage takes it outside the instant buy threshold. I'm hoping for two things, one someone else buys it to take the pressure off me, no one else buys it for a while so I can let the credit card cool down after the garden expense.

I know what I should do, buy it now and be damned, then move on some stuff I'm not overly interested in to make up some of the deficit. I'll move some stuff on anyway but timing is everything.

I'm actually sorted on the diagrams up to S-10 now, took a lot of pavement pounding through the Facebook groups but I have them and the Pacifics.

P-14.jpg

I actually prefer the P-10 with 'Skyline' casing rather than the full 'Golden State' fairings, same for the MT classes.

I'm still missing ones after P but they'll fall from the tree if I shake it hard enough.

Not sure if you're aware, three P-10's were also faired in, 2484, 85 & 86 and painted in Daylight colours, later all black.

There isn't enough engine mass/bulk to carry off the faring like the GS classes for my eyes I'm afraid. These three were based mostly around San Francisco on the San Joaquin Daylight.

SP 2484 (6).jpg
 
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Focalplane

Western Thunderer
Yes the three San Joaquin Pacifics had a simpler streamlined casing which I rather like. They didn’t last long, MT-4s replaced them. The funniest Daylights were the painted A-6 Atlantics for the Sacramento Daylight that connected with the San Joaquin. They didn’t last long either.

Looking at photos of the S-10 to S-14 classes the differences are not great except for the tender, which can be very variable. Personally I like Vanderbilts.

Another Sunbeam shot:

267712C1-1DC4-420F-BDB8-DDB2B02BD18C.jpeg
 

Focalplane

Western Thunderer
Mick, the O scale Big Boy is certainly a very nice model!

It is hard to believe that a 1972 brass model is now 50 years old, half way to becoming an antique.
 
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