Nick Dunhill’s workshop building a SECR P class from the Alpha Graphics Kit.

[Yorkshire Dave]

On a historical note Wainwright designed the P based on the LBSC A1/A1x (Terrier/Rooter) acquired by and to operate the Sheppy Light Railway.

However, it was deemed not as successful as the LBSC A1/A1x.

 

[mickoo]

Hi all
I wonder if someone could help. You can see from the attached photos my model with it's scratchbuilt cab. It is substantially different in dimensions to the kit cab! Of course the kit boiler doesn't fit so I'm scratchbuilding one of those too now.

The tank tops extend beyond the inner edge of the tank sides up to the boiler clothing. Can anyone tell me whether there's a gap between the tank top and boiler clothing or does the boiler clothing sit on top of the tank top?

Thanks

 

[Nick Dunhill]

So cracking on, this week I have built a boiler and smokebox. The boiler in the kit is too big, the smokebox is the wrong shape (and too big) and the tanks too wrong, although I did use the tank sides, modified of course.







I just didn't like the way the tanks were designed with front, top and rear that go across from side to side. The top of the boiler and firebox just sits on the tank top. By the time I had reduced the tank sides to the height of one of the later 6 (the tanks and bunker in the kit are too low for the first 2 and too high for the last 6) the boiler would have sat too low.

I made my own.





Phew.

 

[Dave Holt]

Nick.
Another marvellous looking model in progress, although not a prototype that holds any interest for me. However, I would query the heading for these posts as you appear to be scratch building with some minor aid from an Alpha Graphics kit.
Dave.

 

[Pencarrow]

Nick.
Another marvellous looking model in progress, although not a prototype that holds any interest form. However, I would query the heading for these posts as you appear to be scratch building with some minor aid from an Alpha Graphics kit.
Dave.

Nick Dunhill’s workshop building a SECR P class with occasional assistance and much hinderance from the Alpha Graphics Kit.

 

[Yorkshire Dave]

The headline on the newspaper underneath in the photo seems to sum it up.

 

[Nick Dunhill]

Aw Dave " The Things I Love About You!"

 

[Eastsidepilot]

Surely we are getting to the stage where 'some' kits are just not worth paying out for in the first place !

 

[Rob R]

Surely we are getting to the stage where 'some' kits are just not worth paying out for in the first place !

Between Mr Dunhill and Mickoo we got there about 4 or 5 kits ago.............

 

[Nick Dunhill]

Lots of the kits that have come across my bench for assembly recently are quite old designs and the bar has been raised quite a lot since and they are showing their age. (Or in the case of the ACE NBR Atlantic is utter bollocks and ought never to have been on the market.)

Gives me and the boy Davies something to moan about in the pub so I'm grateful!

 

[mickoo]

Lots of the kits that have come across my bench for assembly recently are quite old designs and the bar has been raised quite a lot since and they are showing their age. (Or in the case of the ACE NBR Atlantic is utter bollocks and ought never to have been on the market.)

Gives me and the boy Davies something to moan about in the pub so I'm grateful!

A German engineer I had the great pleasure to work with many times told me 'all solutions lie at the bottom of the beer glass, some take more glasses than others'.

Not only has the bar been raised design wise but also expectation wise, such that even good kits can fall short of what the customer requires and take as much work to reach the criteria.

Whats really hard is very old crap kits folks want ultra modern and detailed models from, in those cases it far cheaper and faster to knock up aids to scratch building and there have been several of those littered over the previous years and there are several more to come on the books.

 

[simond]

Ah yes, the “four pint problem”.

an alternative from the old days of early closing, “the five pint panic”

 

[mickoo]

Surely we are getting to the stage where 'some' kits are just not worth paying out for in the first place !

That really does depend on your expectations, some people are really happy with what's in the box; I have no issue with that at all and fair play to them as long as it makes them happy.

 

[Eastsidepilot]

Ah yes, the “four pint problem”.

an alternative from the old days of early closing, “the five pint panic”

Where I used to live, two house moves back, the village had two pubs, the nearest town being some 7 miles away, so come closing time on a Friday night the non-locals would bugger off home and leave us locals to be "locked in" as it were . Problem sorting usually amounted to a few more than 4-5 pints.
Any unsorted business at the end of the session was discussed over breakfast served up by the chef at 7.30 am later in the morning .
Although I could never quite get used to a pint of Guinness with eggs and bacon

 

[Nick Dunhill]

More P Class 'fun.'

Since the last post I have added the bits of the tanks inside the cab, the cab floor and the lockers/splashers. I had to cut the floor in half to get it in but thats OK as I'll be adding planking later.



I made the cab roof next. It's quite challenging to make with all the guttering and the verandah shape. I roughed the end bits of guttering out of scrap, soldered them on and fashioned it to shape with my grinder.



The bag of castings in the background are for the loco. Most of it is only useful as fishing weights.



oops a bit squint in that photo.







Also in the pics you can see that I have added the rest of the lamp irons. The GA only shows 4 irons front and rear. was the additional middle pair a SR addition?

Also you can see from the above pic (if you zoom in!) that the front top lamp iron has a small additional hook incorporated in it. In the historic photo of number 325 you can see cord/air hose(?) connections from the front and rear coaches. Presumably this is a coms system for push-pull working. Anyone any idea how it works and has any details of it?

Ta.

 

[Yorkshire Dave]

Also in the pics you can see that I have added the rest of the lamp irons. The GA only shows 4 irons front and rear. was the additional middle pair a SR addition?

Yes, when built they carried 4 lamp irons front and rear. The additional set (usually bolted to the front of the smokebox casing) were added by the SR to accomodate the 6 position headcodes used by the SR and BR(S).

In the historic photo of number 325 you can see cord/air hose(?) connections from the front and rear coaches. Presumably this is a coms system for push-pull working. Anyone any idea how it works and has any details of it?

I believe the SECR used a vacuum and cord motor train system - I'll have to check my books

 

[Yorkshire Dave]

Following on I see this is the photo of the motor train at Greenwich Park (closed 1917) and the coaches are converted from LCDR bogie coaches.

The LCDR used the Westinhgouse air brake system - I'll also check my LCDR books.

 

[Yorkshire Dave]

The SECR used a rod and pulley system for operating their motor trains, however this was unreliable. In 1914 they converted a number of ex LCDR 0-4-4Ts (R and R1) using the the LBSC air operated push-pull system which lasted until the end of steam on BR(S).

The P class had their rod and pulley system removed around 1914 and were relegated to other duties as they did not have sufficient power, coal capacity nor the range to handle the increasing carriage weights and lengthier motor train journeys.

The LCDR coaches converted for rod and pulley motor train operation had their air brakes removed and replaced by vacuum brakes by the SECR.

 

[Nick Dunhill]

Thanks Dave , very interesting. The poor old P classes were redundant in 1912! Yet most soldiered on into BR, what on earth did they do after that? I heard a story that one of the preserved locos was lent to a different heritage railway and they had the same issue of feebleness and sent it back!

 

[Yorkshire Dave]

During WWI a few were left working short motor trains around Sevenoaks and Isle of Sheppy to name a few and into war service around Folkestone, Dover and Richborough ports. Two were transferred to France for ROD duty around Boulogne.

After grouping in 1923 they ended up on shunting and pilot duties around Kent, Dover and Folkestone harbours - the latter is where they spent most of their lives with forays to Shoreham and Ridham ports.