Prototype Where? When, What is going on?

daifly

Western Thunderer
I wonder if anyone has noticed the way the tractors are secured to the wagon.
I rather hoped that I had drawn attention to it in post #1!
Thanks also to Paul B. for the Bylines and HMRS references. All of these publications are in my library and I clearly need to look closer to home for answers!
Dave
 

Osgood

Western Thunderer
At just 1.34 tonnes, the offset loading of the tractors would not have been considered an issue.
 

AJC

Western Thunderer
As is London Bridge and a few others!

True! Though LB is navigable to the stranger (now) in a way that Victoria really isn't - I still can't understand why WH Smith is where the unified departure boards should be. I really do stand on the concourse trying to remember whether I need an SECR destination or a Brighton one... Anyhow, thank you to @daifly for posting the picture which I'm going to take a close look at again, it's that kind of image.

Adam
 

daifly

Western Thunderer
Following on from the great success of WT members at identifying Meltham, here is another puzzle. This photo was posted by Martin Wynne on the Templot Club website to show the inside half scissors formation at the right hand side of the photo. The original item is here:

There are several interesting (to me!) features:
  • The track is typical of the GW as are the signals
  • The Castle has bulled-up buffers and inside valve covers and what looks like a Churchward 3500gal tender
  • It also has red lamps (this started changing to white from end-1936) and they denote an express passenger train
  • The coaching stock all appears to be non-corridor stock
  • It is a warm day - little visible steam and a LOT of open windows in the large building behind
  • The loco to the left is tricky to pin to a class - I suspect that it is an 0-4-2 with a big Dean dome but obviously has a small bunker and has a shunters truck attached at the rear with something else in the four-foot behind that.
  • There is a crane with elevated jib behind that loco
  • The first visible wagon has a large X on the door
  • The train appears to be climbing out of a slight cutting with the parallel main track on a higher level.
  • The fifth coach appears to be crossing an underbridge
inside_half_scissors.jpg

I'm sure that observant WTers will find more of interest than these few observations but my question is simply: Where is this?
Dave
 

simond

Western Thunderer
The trap points are perhaps a little unusual, I’ve seen them in this sort of compact arrangement in a couple of other pictures, but I’d suggest they are not typical.

I’m struggling to work out what the post, partially hidden by the nearer signal, is, just this side of the wagon bearing the “x”. Could it be a colour light or searchlight? And is there a second one above the rear end of the leading coach?

the shunters‘ truck inscription is a single line of text.

there is a veritable forest of signals in the distance.

it won’t help in the location search, but I’m surprised there is no buffer plank number on the Castle
 

daifly

Western Thunderer
The trap points in that configuration were not uncommon on the GWR at goods yard exits in the situation shown here. I posted a photo for @SimonT a while back:
I think the buffer plank number is just lost in the shadow.
So many curiosities!
Dave
 

martin_wynne

Western Thunderer
Never mind all that stuff about wheeled objects. :)

The real puzzle is that bolted half-chair adjacent to the fishplate in the extreme bottom left. Why is it needed? And having the bolt on the gauge side is unusual. It means the special chair has the opposite direction of rail inclination from the more usual bolted half-chairs and slide chairs.

Such chairs are not used willy-nilly, there has to be a reason. It means the vee rail needs an extra bolt hole drilled if it ever needs replacement.

My only guess is that because a key would need to be driven towards the fishplate, there is no room to swing the keying hammer there. But that doesn't explain having the bolt on the gauge side, and there are hundreds of similar locations which don't have such bolted half-chairs.

Martin.
 
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parky

Western Thunderer
who else would have spotted that but Martin :) Yes a gauge side fitting would surely foul the wheel flange. Not sure if the other chair on that sleeper isn't the same and has more 'meat' on it
I like the interleaved catch point and assume that whilst it looks complex a simple modification to one of your templates. Simple. when you know how ;)
 

daifly

Western Thunderer
Swindon.... I would have thought all the GW fans would have known :) The circled building matches this one.
I have to hang my head in shame but in my defence, this is not a location that was much-photographed. In fact, a search through several books on Swindon works has failed to yield a single photo of the large building in the background. Fortunately, reference to contemporary maps and other views reveals this building to be 'J' shop - the iron foundry (probably why all the windows were open!)
This damaged postcard view was found whilst searching the web for 'Swindon Trip Week'.
IMG_2573 2.PNG
'J' shop was just to the east of the pattern store (the building with the tanks on top and both buildings still exist! You just don't get to see them from this direction unless youre passing by train.

The postcard also explains the X-marked wagons which are presumably for internal use. The need for the crane to lift the boilers is also explained. And, yes, the trippers ARE wandering over the main line!

No sign here of a half scissors or bolted chair though.

Thanks for everyones input.

Dave
 

LarryG

Western Thunderer
I'm late to the table, but the coaching stock was mostly standard Collet BE high waist all-door corridor stock. Note the roof brackets for destination boards as someone else had mentioned. The cream looks dowdy, but this is probably an illusion caused by full panelled lining out.
 

Lancastrian

Western Thunderer
It's a shame that we cannot see more bottom left of the image, as there seems to be a triangle between the two rails of the crossing vee, or is this just a fluke ?

Ian
 

martin_wynne

Western Thunderer
It's difficult to place on the track plan


am I right to think the train is heading SW?
Hi Simon,

Also available on the superb 1885 large-scale 125"/mile Town Plans mapping, including the mixed-broad-gauge rails:

Explore georeferenced maps - Map images - National Library of Scotland

There is also an earlier 25" map with coloured buildings:

Explore georeferenced maps - Map images - National Library of Scotland

None of which leaves me any wiser about the location of the photo. :(

Martin.
 

SimonT

Western Thunderer
To help.
Capture.JPG

The large building (J Shop) is to the right of the letters B.M.345.1. It is now part of the temple to commerce that is the Outlet Centre (or is it Center?). The weigh house, with the water tank, was built after this edition of the map. The tree on the extreme right of the photo is part of St Mary's chuchyard and still exists. The station is to the upper right of the plan.
Churchward was crossing the line here when he was run down by a train.
Snip of the map is from the National Library of Scotland and is for imforative purposes only.
 

Dave F.

Western Thunderer
I had and restored a 1943 DB VAK 1 tractor and although similar the ones in the picture have the cranked in air intake to the oil bath whereas mine had an upright pipe with a mushroom top to it so I think these tractors are VAK 1As. The later Cropmasters had a different casting to below the pressed steel radiator grill, originally the VAK1 had a cast iron or cast steel grill which was often broken in pieces.

Dave,
Ex tractor fan !!!
 
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daifly

Western Thunderer
The large building (J Shop) is to the right of the letters B.M.345.1. It is now part of the temple to commerce that is the Outlet Centre.... The weigh house, with the water tank, was built after this edition of the map.
And I was in the temple this very morning! J Shop houses a Marks & Spencer and a Hamleys outlet among many others!

The Pattern Store which Simon calls the Weigh House is now the 'Pattern Church'!

Dave
 
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