LarryG's loco & coach WB (4mm/00)

LarryG

Western Thunderer
The Hawksworth coach was cursed from the start and it ended up in the bin today. I will simply wait now until Hornby re-runs its Hawksworth's in maroon.
 

LarryG

Western Thunderer
Have you got another to do?

Regards Peter
I have some scrap Hornby first class Hawksworths bought just for their bogies and interiors. The latter will go on some brass coaches I intend building before summer starts. I etched my own GWR and LMS floors and underframes a few years ago so I could build just about anything using Comet etched sides.
 

LarryG

Western Thunderer
I fancied building a few LMS corridor composites including the D2117 post-war variants for the proposed 4mm/00 layout. The post-war compo differed in having two additional doors on the corridor side and non-opening lavatory windows. After the first two batches were built, the sliding windows were changed to the equal-element size as shown below. A number were built on underframes salvaged from wartime casualties.

Comet produce the sides, but all my 60' underframes had been used up during the run-down of the business in 2017, so I couldn't build any 60' LMS coaches. In the end, I decided to treat myself to a small etched sheet that would give me the prewar composites and the postwar variant with different windows plus 60' underframes should I need them for other LMS coach types....
WEB LMS Compo 1.jpg

I had intended BR maroon livery, but I forgot!
WEB LMS Compo 2.jpg
 
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LarryG

Western Thunderer
I built a couple more for swaps. These shots show the differences between the versions. Below is the LMS D1969 built between 1937 and 1940....
WEB LMS compo 3.jpg

Fall-back lavatory window vents and unevenly spaced window vents. Early coaches only had roof vents over the compartments....
WEB LMS Compo 4.jpg

The LMS D2117 built between 1946 and 1948 with the evenly spaced window vent adopted in 1940. Two additional doors in corridor side...
WEB LMS Compo 5.jpg
One-piece lavatory windows...
WEB LMS Compo 6.jpg
 

LarryG

Western Thunderer
Back in the sounds of the nation around 1978, Derek of Lawrence Scale Models wanted to add to 'our' growing range of rtr coaches some Gresley suburban's in teak livery. I carried out an experiment on a tobacco tin lid, and came across this tin while tidying up during 'lock-down'.

A base of BLMC AB88 Bracken was used from a spraycan. The grained teak effect was done with cotton material, but I cannot recall how! Save to say the process was not commercial as far as I was concerned....

WEB teak test.jpg

A restored teak coach at Carrog....
WEB Teak .jpg

I devised a speedier alternative that sufficed for the period, and sprayed the coaches with a colour close to Bracken that I mixed in cellulose. While the paint was wet, it was over-sprayed it with a darker brown with the air pressure so low that the gun sprayed fine dots. They sank into the wet paint and a gloss varnish in cellulose ensured a glass-like surface on which to add lining (if required). It was adequate and took no longer than spraying coaches in maroon or whatever.

I continue to use this rather crude finish on corridor partitions to this day. There are numerous ways of getting there. I happen to spray the partitions with Halfords Ford Tuscon Beige. While wet, I over spray very lightly and from a distance Halford Ford Sable Brown. For LMS Period III coaches I leave the partitions a light colour. For earlier stock I spray the second colour a couple of extra 'wafts' to darken the finish.

Many years later and with valuable tips from fellow pro painter, Dave Studely, I found it possible to do a proper grained finish very speedily.
 
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LarryG

Western Thunderer
What's on my workbench? Well, this is what was on it 45 years ago, but seeing as I don't have a Loco WB, it'll have to go here...

I was painting an O gauge A3 for someone. The electric fan drew out the smell of cellulose paint and the pocket watch was from my bus days. Items on the bench that are still in use today are the Draughtmans pens and compass, the upturned plastic lid of clean water and the bottle of Meths for Methfix transfers, plastic ruler and Kraft knife. I worked from a garden shed in those days, but "worked" is a relative term. Some famous names from the railway world have sat in that shed .....

WEB Workbench B.jpg
 
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PeteT

Member
A close-up view of the brake end. Those extra large steps were in fact added strengthening to prevent telescoping in the event of a collision or derailment....
View attachment 98192
View attachment 98193
I had the Stones vents etched in nickel silver some years ago to speed up the building process. The LMS and BR were fully aware of the strength of these coaches and used them as the leading vehicle in many express trains...

Hi Larry, apologies for dragging this up from 15 months ago, but I am looking at doing a D1730. I was aware of the underframe, and rivetted ends, but didn't know about those end strengthening steps. I presume from what you wrote that these were an original fit? or was it a later addition? I haven't seen photos of the braked end yet. I know they didnt have end windows, but aside from photos in Jenkinson & Essery, and the LMS Journals, all the photos I have seen are from the other direction!

I expect there could be GAs within the Met Cam archives.

Edited to add that Jenkinson & Essery do show the brake end of the slightly later BFKs to D1845 with these steps.
 
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LarryG

Western Thunderer
Hi Pete, I am pretty sure the end plates were added later. I came across them on D1730's in BR blood & custard.
 

LarryG

Western Thunderer
A pal has sent a new Hornby 'Princess Royal' along for me to look at and gloss it up a bit. Comparing it with the Ivatt Duchess, Hornby has reverted to a brownish maroon. The front end is noticeably facing upward and the lining below the cabside slopes downwards...
WEB Lizzie 1.jpg

I applied new lining after removing the original. That at the front disguises the upward tendency...
WEB Lizzie 3.jpg
The parts in the accessory bag were fitted, but i carefully elongated the slots for the front step tags so that they could be fitted further forward to clear the leading bogie wheels....
WEB Lizzie 4.jpg

Mascol was applied to the cab windows and the maroon given a spray coat of clear cellulose. It was very much thinned but is enough to give the paint a shinier finish. Smokebox and cab roof where then sprayed an almost matt finish...
WEB Lizzie 5.jpg
 

LarryG

Western Thunderer
When painting professionally for other clients, I use colours that are generally accepted as "correct". This is no lightweight statement, as I received a lot of help over the years.

But when it comes to painting models intended for myself, then I use a different set of colours. Why? Well because I know what colour things would have been the first day they were painted, but they didn't look like that after a few years in the atmosphere.

Western Region 'brown' on buildings varied so much that I can only assume different various colours were initially applied even before weathering started to make its mark! 'Normal' BR(WR) brown & cream was certainly used on stations along the Cambrian Coast. The brown went matt and the cream bleached to off-white after some years.

Blood & custard coaches bleached a lot and differed in appearance from freshly painted vehicles and yet for some reason the carmine red non-corridor coaches never bleached to the same extent. The maroon repaints that started to appear from late 1956 looked dowdy in comparison especially on a wet winters day and yet would gleam brightly in full summer sunlight. Maroon corridor coaches on the London Midland and Eastern Regions always looked smart and glossy, but the same could not be said for the Western region coaching stock. Fewer coats of varnish or cleaning detergents might account for this.
 

GrahameH

Western Thunderer
Couldn't agree more with the above Larry, unlike constant layout lighting ( or lack of it ) the elements make a huge contribution in the way we see things.
Now where's that oily rag ?

G
 

LarryG

Western Thunderer
Needless to say I suppose, I went O gauge again after my March 2020 post.

CANVASS ROOFS & RAINSTRIPS:


I decided to convert some of the stock of etches into 4mm/OO coaches starting on LMS 60' coaches. First off was a Period I D1704 brake composite built in the late 1920's and rebuilt with Stanier sides on the original wooden framework in 1940. Stanier added an additional lavatory at the luggage end. I had to cut this window out because it was not on my etches...
WEB LMS D1704A 1.jpg

These 49 coaches retained their original canvass roofs, matchboard ends and single compartment doors. I haven't seen any scale drawings for these rebuilds and so we went off the original framing when spacing out the windows. They retained 2' wide luggage doors...
WEB LMS D1704A 2.jpg

LMS D1720A styarted life as a Period II coach built in 1930 and was also the subject of rebuilding in 1940. Unusually, it had 4' 6" windows in first class. Quite why it had fall-back lavatory windows is a mystery when the D1704A had an LNWR style vent over the lav window. Canvass roof.....
WEB LMS D1720A 1.jpg

Another 60 footer, an LMS D1791 corridor composite. Although of the raised panelling style, these coaches introduced double compartment doors...
WEB LMS D1782 1.jpg

LMS 60' D1791 corridor composite. Similar to D1782, but flush sided. Although taken indoors tonight, this is how the cream really looks...
WEB LMS D1791.jpg
 
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LarryG

Western Thunderer
A couple of LMS D2117 corridor composites have been built. This was the post-war development with two additional doors on the corridor side and different toilet windows. The blood & custard has shell roof vent introduced to the LMS by Stanier and my own welded bogies...
WEB LMS D2117 1.jpg

This coach was built completely from my own etchings of 15thou thickness (to reduce costs)...
WEB LMS D2117 2.jpg

Some of these post-war coaches used parts recovered from wartime casualties. It has torpedo vents and the older bogies, which on this model are modified Bedford from Shapeways. This coach has Comet 12thou sides on my parts...
WEB LMS D2117 3.jpg

The coaches built at Wolverton seem to be charqacterised by rivetted chassis instead of welded. The livery is the final BR maroon variant introduced jus prior to the introduction of blue & grey, hence the yellow band over first Class...
WEB LMS D2117 4.jpg
When Wheeltappers ceased trading, I went over to using comet roofs, however, the Dart Castings roof is on these two composites.
 
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LarryG

Western Thunderer
One of my friends sent me some O gauge goodies for Xmas so when he asked me to identify a coach on the front cover of the latest 'Backtrack' mag, it occurred to me I could do something for him. The 4mm scale etchings are my own stock.

The floor and ends were experimental back in 2013 and the CAD's were done for me by the late John Fozard. In pre-computer days when I had to produce hand drawn artwork for etching bus radiators, I found that it was possible t get three levels out of two-stage etching. The grooves between the planks are in relief and the communication chord 'goal posts' are actually in front of them. Obviously, all this detail was a time-saver when I was still trading. Ignore the lower horizontal rib ~ it was a left over line that we forgot to delete!
WEB LMS 2 window 1.jpg

The almost completed coach. It will be sprayed BR blood & custard this weekend...
WEB LMS 2 window 2.jpg
 

Mike Garwood

Western Thunderer
Larry
You never fancied moving your work up to 7mm? By that I mean the drawings being moved to 7mm. Just a question...

Hope you and yours are safe

Mike
 
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