7mm Corwen Road

LarryG

Western Thunderer
...............I bet your pleased with Dapol's Manor announcement yesterday.
I only got the news this morning via a Rails email, so yes, terrific news. I'm more at home building & painting models on the workbench than building & operating layouts, but the news of a 'Manor' is definitely encouraging.

EDIT: You should receive parcel Wednesday Andy.
 
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LarryG

Western Thunderer
Dangerman @ work. I found the time & weather to do the necessary today. In the best tradition of snowflake tele, I should perhaps warn viewers that this post contains scenes of violence and outmoded techniques that may offend...:p

WEB tracklift 1.jpg
My days of chiseling cork off baseboards are in the past. A nice clean start is the best route I find. The baseboard frame has been narrowed at the bottom end...
WEB tracklift 2.jpg
WEB track 40.jpg
A big re-think about a new layout is going on, as I have been well impressed with the sheer simplicity of friend Adrian Rowland's latest layout
 
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LarryG

Western Thunderer
Ordered the 'usual' 8' x 4' marine ply early this morning, but it's still not been delivered. I'll tackle the baseboard tops tomorrow, then it'll be a cork-down gluing session.

My very rough layout plan could be described as Ruabon out of Lazonby. I'm not adverse to using Peco Insulfrog 'slips', but I wonder if Gaugemaster frog-juicers would work with an Electrofrog double slip?
 
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simond

Western Thunderer
Larry,

I don’t know the answer to your question, but having pondered it for a few moments, I believe that it should work fine.

The critical details will be where the gaps are, but in principle, if it works with switches (or relays, etc) it should work with a juicer (provided you never want to run analog DC of course).

Fit the feeds to the two outer stock rails, 4 insulated fishplates on the rails leading out from the crossings, and you should need two juicer channels, one for each crossing.

I have a diagram if you’re wiring it conventionally, but I guess there are plenty out there on the www, just shout if I can help.

atb
Simon
 

76043

Western Thunderer
I understand the Peco Technical Advice Bureau is pretty good at responding with helpful solutions, might be worth contacting them.
Tony
 

GrahameH

Western Thunderer
I wonder if Gaugemaster frog-juicers would work with an Electrofrog double slip?

Larry,

I used the Tam Valley Frog Juicer with one quite a few years ago and wired as Simon explained above, no problems whatsoever with the set up.

As 76043 says too, Peco Tech Advice chaps have always been extremely helpful if needed.

G
 

JimG

Western Thunderer
With the two crossings on a diamond, or slip, Tam Valley state that you have to use two juicers which can be interconnected so that as soon as one juicer is triggered, the other one is set to the opposite polarity. They recommend using their dual Juicer, or a pair from their hex juicer, both of which have the interconnection facility. I made the mistake of using two independent single Tam Valley juicers on the diamond crossing on my US layout and got a lot of switching errors until I contacted Tam Valley who gave me the answer. I fitted a dual juicer - no further problems.

Jim.
 

Andy P

Western Thunderer
A call to Gaugemaster might be your best option Larry, but I recon it should work fine as basically it's only two Points, back to back.
 

GrahameH

Western Thunderer
With the two crossings on a diamond, or slip, Tam Valley state that you have to use two juicers which can be interconnected so that as soon as one juicer is triggered, the other one is set to the opposite polarity. They recommend using their dual Juicer, or a pair from their hex juicer, both of which have the interconnection facility. I made the mistake of using two independent single Tam Valley juicers on the diamond crossing on my US layout and got a lot of switching errors until I contacted Tam Valley who gave me the answer. I fitted a dual juicer - no further problems.

Jim.

Totally agree, sorry I should have mentioned this in my earlier response !
 

simond

Western Thunderer
With the two crossings on a diamond, or slip, Tam Valley state that you have to use two juicers which can be interconnected so that as soon as one juicer is triggered, the other one is set to the opposite polarity. They recommend using their dual Juicer, or a pair from their hex juicer, both of which have the interconnection facility. I made the mistake of using two independent single Tam Valley juicers on the diamond crossing on my US layout and got a lot of switching errors until I contacted Tam Valley who gave me the answer. I fitted a dual juicer - no further problems.

Jim.

That’s curious. In 50% of the possible routes through a slip, the frogs must be the opposite, and in the other 50%, they must be same polarity.

A. B
> <
C. D

A to B and C to D require same polarity for both frogs. A to D and C to B require opposite.

I’ve never used a juicer so I’m interested by Jim & Grahame’s experiences that linking them somehow improves their performance - it clearly could on a live frog diamond, but on a slip?

Atb
Simon

(edit, I did try to put spaces between the letters in my little diagram above, which made it more obvious, but the text editor knows better than me what I want to show, so it helpfully removes them :). You’ll have to imagine !)
 

JimG

Western Thunderer
I’ve never used a juicer so I’m interested by Jim & Grahame’s experiences that linking them somehow improves their performance - it clearly could on a live frog diamond, but on a slip?

I believe that the problem arises when the locomotive chassis can bridge the two crossing noses and the two independent juicers can "fight" each other to determine the polarities. On my US layout, the locomotives were all Bo-Bo diesels and were long enough to do this. Maybe with a shorter steam or diesel loco, the problem would not occur because they were not long enough to bridge the two crossing nose sections. My original experience with the two independent juicers was that they would work some of the time but it was completely random and I couldn't work out what was happening.

In effect the diamond is treated in the same way as an automatic reversing juicer on a reversing loop when both must switch together to avoid possible problems.

Another factor is that I was using a MERG DCC cut-out to protect the layout and my NCE Powercab and it was the cutout which was operating to stop everything. Juicers normally operate a lot faster than any DCC cutout but possibly a period of uncertainty between juicers fighting for control lengthened the period of the juicers shorting to then operate the cutout. It could be that if the cutout was removed that the diamond would have worked well with barely imperceptable hesitations while the juicers were having their arguments.

Jim.
 

Andy P

Western Thunderer
Alton Model Centre will be one of my Local Shops after the move to Amp Sher. About 20 minutes up the road and next to the Mid Hants Watercress line.
I will be lucky as I will have 3 good choices, as along will Alton, I'll have AC Models in Eastleigh / 30 minutes away and about the same time in the other direction is Gaugemaster, who now look after Heljan spares along with much other stuff.
I will also be able to try the new Kernow store for a change.
When I lived there before I used Alton a lot and Bob, the previous owner had a Dapol Class 56 re painted in EW&S Livery just after EW&S came into being, by your good self I believe, or so I was told, anyway it was an excellent job.
 

Andy P

Western Thunderer
I remember the fictitious liveries in I think it was Model Rail. I may still have them somewhere. I think I remember a yellow 31 for some strange reason.
 
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